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Not In My Backyard: The GOPers Complicating Obama's Gitmo Closure

Republicans have already settled on a five-letter messaging counter-attack to President Obama's plan to shutter the Guantanamo Bay prison within a year: NIMBY. Within the past few days, John McCain and Karl Rove have helped reinforce the perception that Guantanamo detainees could not be moved to U.S. soil without a popular backlash.

As McCain told Fox News yesterday:

Where are you going to send [the detainees]? That decision I would have made before I'd announced the closure, because I don't know of a state in America that wants them in their state. It's going to -- you think Yucca Mountain is a NIMBY problem? Wait till you see this one.

Never mind that McCain seemed to have made that decision in 2007 ...

Yes. I would close Guantanamo Bay. And I would move those prisoners to Fort Leavenworth.

Ft. Leavenworth, Kansas, is the military's only maximum-security prison, making it a strong option for the Obama administration during deliberations on the future of Guantanamo's 240 or so remaining occupants. But not if Sen. Sam Brownback has anything to say about it. He and three House Republicans from the state already have introduced bills in Congress that would bar the government from moving detainees from Cuba to Kansas.

But Brownback isn't the only Republican taking a pre-emptive cue from Rove and offering bills to close off Obama's possible Guantanamo alternatives.

Lawmakers from South Carolina are promising a similar NIMBY fight over the Charleston Naval Brig, and California Republicans are kicking and screaming over transferring detainees to Camp Pendleton in their state.

Most of the Republicans' "not in my backyard" talking points rely on ginning up fear that housing detainees in U.S. prisons would make the facilities into magnets for terrorist attacks from outside. GOP rhetoric on the issue also suggests that the most dangerous of Guantanamo's current occupants, estimated to number between 50 and 60, would pose a significant escape risk if housed in the U.S. -- although little to no data has been offered to support that claim.

In fact, the Bush administration had been negotiating the release as many as 100 Guantanamo detainees to Yemen, despite prison security levels there that allowed an estimated 23 "high-level" terrorists to go free in 2006.

If Yemeni jails can be under consideration, one wonders why Republicans are opposed to the very consideration of their local prison facilities. Let's ask Brownback himself what he thinks the security standards should be for moving Guantanamo detainees ...

On the subject of security, we can reasonably expect that Guantanamo Bay detainees should be secured as well as the criminals at the Federal Bureau of Prisons Administrative Maximum Facility in Colorado.

That jail, known in popular parlance as Supermax, already houses convicted terrorists Richard Reid, Zacarias Moussaoui, Ramzi Yousef, and Ted Kaczynski, a.k.a. the Unabomber.

Maybe Brownback can have a chat with Colorado Republican Rep. Doug Lamborn and Mike Coffman, since they're threatening to prevent Guantanamo detainees from being transferred to Supermax. After all, a spokesman for Colorado's Democratic governor, Bill Ritter, told the AP that "there's no reason to take a 'not in my backyard' approach."

But let's not hold our breath. It looks like Republicans are having too much fun planning their obstructionist tactics on Guantanamo.


81 Comments

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This is so stupid. Since when do republicans worry that prisons aren't secure enough for the worst of the worst? It's not as if the prisoners are being allowed to walk into the shopping mall.

We imprisoned Charles Manson and Ted Bundy and Timothy McVeigh but we're afraid of some "terrorist"?

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Agreed. Do the GOP really think that our prisons are allowing prisoners to escape willy-nilly?

This is the hat this ass-burglars are going to hang their hat on?

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Of course it's absurd, crazy-ass pony poo. And they don't care, because it's no more crazy-ass than that we could drill, baby, drill our way out of dependence on foreign oil with our 3% supplies offshore.

It's populist BS (escalating away from the equine here) that people who don't have time to think will latch onto while the MSM pick up the chant and endlessly repeat it into their ears.

Or, as Bela Lugosi would have said 77 years ago, "Look into my eyes!"

Bleah!

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Lestat asks;

Do the GOP really think that our prisons are allowing prisoners to escape willy-nilly?

Nah, they don't think that, but they want the gullible public to think that.

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Wait...I saw this one on Mythbusters (Do those guys have the coolest job in the world, or what?) All you need is some salsa and a couple of batteries. The salsa is an electrolyte and the batteries can dissolve enough of the iron in the bars so that you can kick them out. Well...it also takes a few months. And some pretty clueless prison guards. And a window that leads outside the prison walls. But otherwise, it could happen.

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Absurd. There are about 10 or 20 real criminals probably and the rest they don't know WTF to do with them. We already have the "mastermind" of the 93 bombing behind bars in colorado I believe. Also, we have the 20th hijacker in jail as well. I actually would have no problem with them building a max security prison on my property to put the 10 or 20 in and I can hurl insults at them on a daily basis until the end of time. Totally absurd.

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This is a good fight to have. It makes the GOP look like wimps.

All of the prisons under consideration in the U.S. are plenty secure. I heard the mayor of one of the towns, I think either in Colorado or Kansas, say that they would be fine with it. These rural towns usually want more prisons and more prisoners because it means more good paying jobs.

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Beat me to it. See my comment below.

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I thought the campaign would've taught McCain about the wonders of "the Google", where all of his prior "Mavericky" statements are on full display, and available to make him look (again) like a lying hypocrite.

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Huh.

If I were a Democrat in a state with a maximum security prison, I'd be all over this. I'd trumpet how well the prison works, how safe everyone would be because of the wonderful professionalism of people working at that prison, I'd talk about how this might mean a boost to the local economy, and I'd finish with a question: "Why do Republicans think so poorly of the wonderful citizens keeping us safe?"

C'mon, Dems. USE THIS.

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Yep, Republicans are disparaging the ability of our military to carry out a basic task.

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Good grief. We agree on something???

It's a new day, indeed.

: )


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Even stupider, as if these guys would survive fifteen minutes if they somehow escaped in a Red State. Any of these guys who think their constituients would be cowering in their basements has forgotten where he comes from. If there was a breakout, they'd grab their guns and hit the roads like it was the first day of deer season.

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Good point and very funny. They would be climbing the walls trying to break back into the prison under a fusilade of gun fire. Too funny.

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If they escaped (oh please) into a Blue State, we would be just as anxious to capture them, but not necessarily behead them on the spot.

We are ALL Americans.

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Here in Kansa, they would probably create a new hunting season just in case any of them escape.

After the iron curtain fell, and the Russians said there were two things the found out about America that befuddled and terrified them.

The first was that there was something actually called "pet food" on our grocery shelves, and that those shelves were longer and better stocked than the produce counter, which simply confused them because they barely had enough human food.

The second was that every year the biggest stnding army of snipers in the world went out for a weekend deer hunt in Pennsylvania. At the time it topped a million gunners, and that was just one state out of fifty.

I'm not in favor of selling saturday-night-specials or AK47's, but the second amendment should put a scare into any supposed terrorist who might consider escaping from a Kansas or Colorado prison.

Especially in hunting season.

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This is assuming they'd live long enough to escape. That peculiar honor among prisoners probably extends to terrorists, either actual or perceived. They'd probably wind up in solitary for their own protection.

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Not a good example of setting aside childish things.

It is so sad to watch the GOP grapple for any kind of wedge issue. Americans just do not care.

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...sad for them in the next election.

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Yep. It really is pathetic. Republicans may as well show up in clown suits.

Does McCain think he can now oppose his own plan from 2007 and nobody will notice? Even with Obama as POTUS? Hasn't he learned yet? Didn't he embarrass himself enough during the campaign?

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I have no worries about putting alleged terrorists in American prisons. I've watched documentaries on our maximum security prisons and it's the detainees who should be worried. And if the government can't protect us from alleged terrorists in our own prison, how can you protect us from the ones abroad.

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"alleged terrorists"

By the time they get to Leavenworth, lets hope that we have weeded ut the "alleged terrorists" from "the terrorists."

I doubt they would be tossed into that pokey unless we knew, BASOAD, that they were guilty.

But, then, we've been disappointed on these matters many times in the past. Justice under Republican rule tends to be deaf, dumb AND blind...

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I was unaware that an official elected at the state level could deny the federal government from using a federal prison, much less a military brig, located in that state.

There are inmates in state and federal prisons in the US that are as great a risk as those in Gitmo, and they are kept secure by the facilities and correctional staffs on site.

There is no legitimate argument for keeping Gitmo open. None.

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"I was unaware that an official elected at the state level could deny the federal government from using a federal prison, much less a military brig, located in that state."

I think you misunderstood. The people cited in this article advancing NIMBY legislation are not at the state level; they are federal legislators. And they can't deny the use of a prison *by themselves* but certainly they have the power to introduce legislation that would do so. That legislation of course must pass a majority vote in both houses of Congress, and there's not a chance in hell of that.

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While Rove et al still want to twist the knife into the back of the US public a few more times, it is nice to see the whole fear of terrorism thing losing its punch. I mean, people in small towns across America freaked out and went "all fear, all the time," like they were NY or DC, or LA even, and people of those large metro areas had a much more balanced perspective by and large.

Of course, it's inevitable that there will be another attack of some sort, from a domestic or overseas source, at some point, but I think America has re-gained its collective mind and, without Presidential ginning up of the fear, tis country will never be as panicky as it was in the early days of this decade.

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It's all grandstanding. I'd love for somebody to show McCain his quote about putting them all in Kansas.

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I think Democrats need to whip their communications strategy into shape. People who complain will always be louder, in this case, Republicans.

But Democrats have an opportunity to be smarter and debunk Republican talking points in force.

The Republicans are great simplifiers, (not a compliment, as it paints everything in a dumb black and white)--it's been one of the most dangerous tools in their arsenal.

Democrats still don't have their act together--time for surrogate boot camp.

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i'm always amazed at how crappy the democrat's communications efforts are; they need to abandon this old fashioned notion that common sense and truth eventually shines through all the bullshit. as my mother always says, "common sense is not so common," somebody please remind the democrats of that.

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Yeah. As usual, the Dems appear to be behind the curve on this Republican crap; they look to have been caught flat-footed...again.

Ho-hum. Surprise....

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Didn't Dubya just buy a big ol' house in Texas?

This is his mess, house them all there and let him clean this big pile of manure up.

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If he isn't going to be using his faux-ranch any more, maybe they can turn it into a maximum-security prison for these alleged supermen.
If it was safe enough for George and his guests for eight years without high walls topped with razor-and-barbed wire and all the other prison-type security, it ought to be safe enough for these with it.

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Ramzi Yousef, the mastermind behind the 1993 WTC bombing and as close to an evil genius as you can get these days, has been held in the Colorado Supermax prison for over 10 years now. This guy eluded capture for over 2 years after the WTC bombing and, while he was eluding authorities, attempted to kill Bhutto and blew up an unlucky plane passenger in a "dry" run for what was supposed to be the Bojinka plot. If we can keep him locked up here in the States, I have to think we should be able to safely lock up any of those currently in Gitmo who are guilty.

What is the alternative - keep these folks at Gitmo forever without a trial? Seriously, is that really an option for a country like the US?

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Once again the Obama administration and Dems sit on their asses while the repubs define yet another issue. Boy McCain sure is a little asshole.

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what are you talking about? just because someone is listening to Republicans does not mean the Republicans are defining the issue. They are always going to have something to say against Obama and his agenda and the news is always going to report on it. That does not automatically mean that the public is going to fall for it. And when I say public that excludes political junkies, politicians and the media. Is it the Obama administration (6 days old) and the Dems who are letting the GOP define another issue or is it the Left that automatically gives a win to the GOP whenever they speak up?

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So let me see if I have this straight. I am supposed to be concerned because the prison that houses the psychopath who walked in off the street and butchered 10 people in a meaningless mass-murder shooting spree is somehow not safe enough to contain the 28 year old Afghani who took some light infantry training at an al Qaeda camp six years ago and who has been detained in virtual solitary confinement for much of the time since?

Really?

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Could we feed them to Hannibal Lecter?

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Yes, that about sums it up. Good to know that the Repubs think so highly of the regular Americans--including, for example, prison staff--that they champion during campaign season.

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This whole nonsense Republican scaremongering campaign is ignoring the fact that most of these people won't be prosecutable anyway because of the nature of the war crimes committed against their persons.

Once they have all had legitimate psych evaluations (instead of the pre-determined outcomes-oriented sort of bullshit evals they have had so far) I won't be surprised to hear that most of them have been judged to have been driven legally insant by their torture, a danger to themselves and others, and that they will therefore be legally committed to psych wards for treatment of their conditions.

We'll have to work out some sort of financial compensation scheme paid to them and/or their families, but I expect most of them to be kept for the rest of their lives in what are essentially very comfortable prisons/mental hospitals.

No, it isn't justice; but it may be the best we can do for them.

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The current GOP leadership is completely in campaign mode. This is a freebie. What damage could it possibly do back home in their home districts to oppose closing Gitmo? None.

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I live next door to Camp Pendleton - close enough that my windows rattle when they practice with the big guns. I have no problem with holding the Gitmo detainees there. The Marines can do the job quite well, thank you.

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I guess this NIMBY argument is really two separate concerns: first, that the prisons would be instant targets for another attack, and second that the prisoners might escape. Both are of course absurd, but let's look at them.

First, escape. Even if escape from Leavenworth or Supermax were possible...where do they go once they escape? They're in the middle of America with no friends or cohorts, unarmed and standing out like a sore thumb, with pictures of themselves on every TV screen and with the vast majority of the population owning firearms. Compare this to an escape from Gitmo; if they get out (pretty much exactly as impossible as getting out of Supermax) they are in Cuba. In other words, they're someplace where they have at least a fighting chance of getting some aid, possibly from the government itself.

Second, terrorist attack. Since when do we think these terrorists are stupid? Or is it that we think these particular individuals are completely indispensable to the organization? Because I think the leadership recognizes that these guys are a lot more valuable to them in jail as martyrs than they are safely back in Pakistan. That's another reason to move them from Gitmo; they are even more valuable as martyrs there. Also, attacking a prison just doesn't work very well for the fundamentals of terrorism; right or wrong you just can't work up public fear and reaction the same way by killing convicts as you can by killing firefighters and "innocent civilians." And let's not even talk about prison architecture, land area, and the mechanics of an attack...but suffice to say, it'll take a much bigger bomb to take out Leavenworth than it would, say, a skyscraper.

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On the possibility of a terrorist attack on the prisons: exactly so. What puts the "terror" in "terrorism" is that it strikes at the places ordinary people find themselves in the course of their daily lives: buses, commuter trains, markets, office buildings, restaurants, hotels. Striking a prison isn't going to terrorize anyone; nobody's going to see that on TV and say "There but for the grace of God go I."

And this isn't Gunsmoke. The bad guys aren't going to ride up with a gang of 10 or 12 and surround the jailhouse with the sheriff and his deputy trapped inside and running out of ammo. If they had firepower enough to seriously target a maximum-security facility, they wouldn't waste it on a prison, they'd go after more attractive soft targets, like buses, commuter trains, markets, etc. And if they were inclined to do that to try to force the issue of release, it wouldn't matter where the prison was located. They could go after American civilians just as easily if the detainees were still at Guantanamo as they could if they were held at Ft. Leavenworth.

This whole NIMBY thing is patently silly.

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This whole NIMBY thing is patently silly

Which means, no doubt, that it will consume the attention of the media and press for weeks on end.

Unless, of course, we have another runaway bride, or the Obamas get their puppy.

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The MSM really are useless, aren't they?

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Which means, no doubt, that it will consume the attention of the media and press for weeks on end.

{sigh} You are, unfortunately, quite right about that.

Maybe we'll get lucky and there will be a dramatic confession in the Caylee Anthony case. Or Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie will split up. These things, of course, are Far More Important than mere politics.

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The GOP plans to be a pain in the ass on EVERYTHING. We just have to admit that now and go on offense.

At least the GOP goes about it with a total tin ear. They're against a stimulus package in this horrible economy, and they want to keep open Gitmo which most Americans hate.

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At least the GOP goes about it with a total tin ear. They're against a stimulus package in this horrible economy, and they want to keep open Gitmo which most Americans hate.

And that may be just what Obama is counting on. Perhaps he's giving the GOP just enough rope for them to hang themselves.

He's held out the hand of bipartisanship. If they spurn it, as they seem bent on doing, then it shows them up for the deadenders they are. I guess they just haven't bled enough yet.

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The main Republican objective today: avoid being prosecuted for war crimes! The more Obama looks into Gitmo the closer he is to filing charges.

Secondary Republican objective: prevent Obama from being successful. The only problem with that of course is that they become the problem and not the solution. And, Obama doesn't really need them.

Primary McCain objective: be a contrarian. It is the only thing he does well. It doesn't make for strong leadership but it gets your name in the papers and gives you some fans.

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This stuff is a little bit ridiculous. I think in the end Obama will successfully find some place to house these detainees. He wouldn't have closed Guantanamo if he didn't have a plan for the them. His personality will push through just about any issue that needs solving. Look at what different news organizations are saying about the subject at :

http://www.newsy.com/videos/obama_s_personality_moves_u_s_agenda/

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I actually think the GOP are building up a campaign issue for the 2010 mid-terms. Try to understand that these are basic scare tactics to create enough of a wedge issue to give the GOP any kind of chance next year. What's sad is the media is going along with this already. Case in point:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/23/world/middleeast/23yemen.html
The emergence of a former Guantánamo Bay detainee as the deputy leader of Al Qaeda’s Yemeni branch has underscored the potential complications in carrying out the executive order President Obama signed Thursday that the detention center be shut down within a year.

You get enough people wetting their pants about where the boogeymen will end up, then those same people will be disturbed enough to listen when some blow-hard NeoCon harps on it.

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"...The emergence of a former Guantánamo Bay detainee as the deputy leader of Al Qaeda’s Yemeni branch.."

So, they know where he is?

Why is he still alive?

Just more proof the R's are all lip service, they don't have the nads to take out a known enemy, even when they know where he's not hiding.

Or is he there because they needed him for this very purpose?

Boehner, McCain, the whole lot of them are either spineless of lying. Or both.

Watt buncha wimps...

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Nothing like a republican to do the right thing for the country, eh?

Patriots? Dare to question their allegiance and see what happens. If they did love their country they would be appalled that Guantanamo exists at all, and should be WILLING to take these prisoners until justice can prevail.

Perhaps we should tell them there is oil in the prisoners' fecal matter just ready for harvesting.

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Good grief. The average gang-banger behind bars is more dangerous than any of the people at Gitmo.

This is beyond stupid. Next.

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Which leads me to repeat "Bring 'em On!" Put them in our federal pens.

Let the white supremacists and the bangers from the hood deal with them on the prison playground.

What do they think their bad guys are badder than our bad guys? Haven't they seen "Pulp Fiction" or "The Godfather?"

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exactly.

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Once again the Obama administration and Dems sit on their asses while the repubs define yet another issue. Boy McCain sure is a little asshole.

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But, but...Obama was going to disarm him with his post-partisan magic!

The only argument here with any sort of merit is the one that says that by having terrorists inside the US we would create a target for terrorist attacks. The only reason they might be a target would be to make a statement (rather than to break anyone out; that isn't going to happen). All that said, there already are all sorts of ways to make statements for a terrorist, and I'd think on balance that not having a place like Gitmo and all that it has come to symbolize (as well as what it actually is) would be a net positive in keeping the US safe from attacks.

I do worry though that if there is another attack, Republicans (i.e. those who truly love the United States), will blame Obama for moving the prisoners from Gitmo into the US (assuming he does so), and the MSM will run with that meme (because you have to report everything everyone is saying, irrespective of truth). Lost will be the fact that every day it's open Gitmo is on the minds and tongues of every terrorist going through training in preparation to attack us and our allies abroad.


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"pose a significant escape risk..."

Yeah, right... IF THE WORLD OF HIGH TECH HAS DONE ANYTHING OTHER THAN GIVING US THE BLOGS, IT HAS CERTAINLY MADE ESCAPING FROM PRISON MUCH HARDER...

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940DE3DA1739F93BA15751C0A96E948260

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Sheeet! I got out didn't I?

OOPS! I mean... Ummm...

Gotta go!

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Republicans = contemptible scum, as usual.

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Article 22 of the Third Geneva Convention prohibits housing PoWs in prisons: "Except in particular cases which are justified by the interest of the prisoners themselves, they shall not be interned in penitentiaries." This was one of the initial complaints about using Guantanamo Bay.

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That's assuming the intention is to regard these guys as POWs. I don't see that as the intent at all.

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We have Crips and Bloods, gang bangers of all types, Mafia hit men, serial killers, sex degenerates, and we even have Charles Manson and his gang in our prisons, so what's to fear from the Gitmo inmates?

Hasn't the blind Sheik and one or more of his gang who are responsible for the first attack on the Trade Center been in jail in the U. S. lo these many years? How is that working out?

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They just love their one of kind concentration camp. Didn't they pay attention to the drubbing they got? Do they think it was unrelated to the Bush Administration's policies? I hope we show them who won the election.

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It's not like they can dig a hole out of prison anymore. We lock up so many inmates that we are pretty good at keeping people in there. I mean when was the last time someone escaped from prison? Has anyone ever broken out of Supermax?

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Never mind that McCain seemed to have made that decision in 2007 ...

One of the great things about John McCain's 2008 Flip-Flop Extravaganza is that for just about every position McCain takes in opposition to the Obama Administration now, it shouldn't be too hard to come up with a position he took earlier that is in basic agreement with what the Administration is advocating.

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It shouldn't be hard at all.

But will the media actually do its job, and highlight these apparent contradictions, and, follow up on that by asking McCain about his change in position?

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But will the media actually do its job, and highlight these apparent contradictions, and, follow up on that by asking McCain about his change in position?

Probably not, but that's where the blogosphere comes in.

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The GOP just wants to make sure that these prisoners go into their cronies' private prisons: GEO Group, CCA and others.

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That's a pretty good thought that I had not really considered yet. Are the republicans trying to help out the private sector by trying to get the prisoners into private prisons?

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So this is what the no-contract Halliburton "internment camps" on US soil were about. And I was worried Cheney/Rove wanted them built to contain the dissidents if the r's won the WH again.

Therefore this protestation is not genuine; it is ginning up fear in order to get Halliburton-KBR back in business. Watch: Boehner etc will leap at the chance to house them once that proposal is "presented."

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McCain: "You think Yucca Mountain is a NIMBY problem? Wait till you see (us try to turn) this (into) one."

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Wow! Don't you people know the first thing about being a terrorist?

You just act natural until they move you into a really important place on the mainland, then at the time when maximum effect/publicity can be attained, you detonate your internal nuclear device.

Message delivered.

Gee willikers.

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The new nickname for the terrorists;
Lecter Lunch.

We've heard how tough they are, maybe we should get an expert opinion...

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There is only one way to ensure that the infamous, diabolical, evil Khalid Sheikh Mohammad does not see the light of day.

John McCain must guard the man himself, perhaps a mini-prison could be built onto McCain's property near Sedona.

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A caller on Air America suggested we the Obama Administration should use Eminent Domain to seize GWB's ranch at Crawford and build a new prison there. There is one person who needs to have them in his backyard.

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I love our new president! He's made a lot of good choices and taken some important, though sometimes symbolic steps to start moving us toward where we should be as a country. And I look forward to what else he has in store. Honoring John McCain at a dinner and showing him any kind of respect however, was not one of the big O's best moves. McCain is a pathetic old man, who will twist himself into a pretzel to curry favor with his repub pals and the news media and get any scrap of attention he can. No flip or flop is too extreme for him. Why does his opinion matter? He lost. He was pretty thoroughly repudiated by the electorate. His judgment is illustrated by his disasterous pick of a VP candidate and the vile and ineffective campaing they ran. The previous comments were right on. The surrogates need to come out and make McCain and the rest of these clowns look as stupid as they are.

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Honoring John McCain at a dinner and showing him any kind of respect however, was not one of the big O's best moves.

I disagree. I think that was a good move. It shows that Obama is willing to take the first step toward bipartisanship, that he was willing to forget the animus of the campaign and work with a former rival for the good of the country. If McCain turns his back on that, it shows up Mr. "Country First" as a fraud.

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You'd think the Republicans would be thrilled to have Khalid Sheikh Mohammed 'tossing salad' in Leavenworth.

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What I love about McCain, he's so Mavericky, he's even against his own 2007 Guantanamo closure plan, which he now realizes was totally reckless for a non-Republican to implement. :rolleyes:

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I thought the Rove daily message machine died with the Jan 20 change? Whose taken over the job of distributing talking points for those lacking any imagination to discuss where Guantanamo prisoners could be jailed?
The TV sound bites are so similar in text; there's almost no variation.

It would be nice for someone to outline the current message machine and whose managing it.

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