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Gregg Recuses Himself From Voting on Stimulus
Sen. Judd Gregg (R-NH), the president's pick for Commerce Secretary, just revealed during an interview with CNBC that he would recuse himself from congressional votes while his nomination is being considered by his former Senate colleagues.
It sounds like a harmless announcement -- but what this effectively does is deny Senate Democrats a gettable GOP vote in favor of Obama's stimulus bill at a time when they're desperately in need of one.
It would have been entirely conceivable for Gregg to follow Sen. Hillary Clinton's (D-NY) example and show up for Senate votes while his nomination was being considered by the chamber. Quite a disappointing move.
Late Update: We've got video of Gregg's comments, after the jump.
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Josh
Matt
Eric
The bill is struggling for votes while we all read the numbers of layoffs and wonder if our particular job is next?
February 4, 2009 11:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
It's bound to be, since we're losing 500 million jobs a month.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8hMJVXt09E
February 4, 2009 12:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
You are usually better than that. That one isn't even funny. Sorry.
February 4, 2009 12:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Since the are only 350million people in the country (give or take) I think it's quite funny that SanFranNan thinks we're losing 500 million a month. She just says stuff and expects everyone to believe it.
February 4, 2009 12:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
It was obviously a slip up. It was supposed to be 500,000 not 500 million. That's not even funny. You want to make a joke about losing 500,000 jobs a month? No wonder republicans got hammered in november.
February 4, 2009 12:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
...and if a Republican said it it would be proof that they were an idiot (if they were from the South) or out of touch.
February 4, 2009 12:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Uh, no, it would be considered a slip up and nobody would make a big deal out of it. You are grasping at straws.
February 4, 2009 12:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
That kind of reminds me of an old joke about a guy listening to an astrophysics lecture in which the lecturer said that the sun would burn out and the earth would crash into it in a million years.
"Excuse me", the man asked. "Did you say a million years?"
The lecturer quickly corrected himself. "Sorry. I meant to say a billion years."
"Thank heaven" the main replied. "For a moment, you had me worried!"
February 4, 2009 1:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here, I'll help you out:
"OMG!!! That was so frickin' hilarious."
You can stop posting the link now.
February 4, 2009 12:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good to see you too, glad to see you're in a good mood today...
February 4, 2009 12:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm just not sure what the point is supposed to be. Are you trying to tell us that Pelosi is "dumber than soap"? Perhaps you'd have more credibility in that area if you hadn't gleefully pulled the lever for Sarah "Putin rears his head" Palin.
And you're right. I am in a pissy mood today. I woke up to find our ex-VP basically saying he couldn't wait to scream "I told you so" at your CIC and Sam the tax-dodging, unemployed, non-plumber imparting his words of wisdom on the masses. One can only take so much.
February 4, 2009 1:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Come on...the real reason you're pissed is that it's 17 degrees in Atlanta!
February 4, 2009 1:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
They key thing is to get a bill, ANY BILL, to the conference committee. That is where the ACTUAL bill will be finalized with supposed give and take from both houses.
It will also be the wake up call to Democrats that no matter what the conference report says, Republicans will be voting NO en masse.
So fix it at conference, send it back to the House and Senate (where it CANNOT be filibustered) and send it to Obama for signature.
The various networks and talking heads will have on only right wing nutbags who will portray it as a totally partisan welfare bill, and whine abut how Barack talked about bipartisanship, blah blah blah.
In the meantime over the next few months:
States will stop laying off people;
Uunemployed people will keep getting checks and health coverage;
All workers will notice a little bump in the pay from less FICA deduction;
Infrastructure will start to get built;
The stock market and 401ks will start gradually rising;
Housing prices will stabilize;
And slowly but surely the great unwashed will feel their lives improving.
Patience people. It'll get done and Barack knows it.
February 4, 2009 12:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
While it's only one pollster, I just saw some new and disturbing numbers from Rasmussen re: the stimulus package. A plurality of those polled now oppose the package - last week, it was the opposite. (and even more supported it two weeks ago) 50% now feel that whatever is passed will make things worse. a significant plurality now prefers a tax-cut only plan.
The package as it stands right now is far from perfect. But it's also far, far, from terrible. And most of what is in there is stimulative and will be spent in the next 18-24 months. The Dems have done a horrible PR job with this. They just aren't making their case...they seem to be assuming that because they won on 11/4/08, the people will support whatever they put forward without them having to explain or defend the legislation against GOP lies and distortions.
Bottom line is that Obama needs to take ownership of this package. What's out there now was written by the House and the Senate. It was not authored by the WH. But the media and the wingnuts are calling it "Obama's plan". If they're going to say that anyway, why not take ownership. Get out there and champion the thing. Pressure Congress to take out the crap and defend the good stuff. We're losing the spin and marketing war here. In the end, all that will matter are the results. But members of Congress are very sensitive to what the headlines and talking heads and polls say. We'll get a piece of crap package if the GOP continues to win the spin wars. And even though they'll be a big reason it's a piece of crap, they'll still pin the whole thing on the Dems if it fails to live up to expectations.
February 4, 2009 11:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
Also from Rasmussen, the Dems generic congressional advantage is down to 4pts. Last week it was 7pts. The week before it was 8 pts. It appears that Americans have very, very short memories. I mean, wasn't it just a few months ago that they - the voters - rejected the Bush years and the GOP?
February 4, 2009 11:59 AM | Reply | Permalink
It's ratsmussen. Take it with a grain of salt.
February 4, 2009 12:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
I learned to trust Rasmussen during both the primary and GE last year. (polls that were almost always good news for Obama) He was one of the most accurate pollsters out there. He may be an evangelical wingnut but I trust his polls.
February 4, 2009 12:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Rasmussen polls consistently come out on the Republican side of the spectrum. Nate Silver calls it "house effects" but it's really just how they conduct polls, including WHO they poll. This particular poll is of "likely voters". What a "likely voter" is when there's no election in the foreseeable future is beyond me.
February 4, 2009 1:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
its simple - they way, way over-represent Republicans in their sampling. for national polls they are ok (but far from the best) but for specific questions like this, where the wording of the question is so important - I wouldn't trust them at all. its crap polling.
February 4, 2009 1:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
That's because everyday we find some new POS stuffed into a supposed "stimulus" bill. Scrub the BS off it and see how quick it passes both chambers with support from both parties.
February 4, 2009 12:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
Maybe Obama needs to get off his ass and use some of the fucking capital that comes with a near landslide presidential victory.
What the fuck is wrong with him? He's so fucking bent on a bipartisanship that will NEVER happen that he's crippling his presidency in its third week.
February 4, 2009 12:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dooom! Dooooooom!
February 4, 2009 12:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ugh. Thankfully it looks all but certain that Dems will get past 60 seats in 2010. (A just-released Quinnipiac poll of Ohio's Senate race shows two probable Democratic candidates crushing GOP star Rob Portman by double-digits, so much for Portman's supposed strength.)
February 4, 2009 11:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
That's good news ... if we're still a whole country and haven't broken down into political territorial regions by then.
February 4, 2009 11:59 AM | Reply | Permalink
Ram through an ineffective stimulus bill that gives $350 million to study the reproductive habits of earwigs and see how fast those Republicans move up in the polls.
February 4, 2009 12:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
You need to stop writing the world "million" when you're advancing your shrill arguments about pork. Rather, you should write $0.35 billion, so you can keep some perspective here.
February 4, 2009 2:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Gregg is a Republican, so comparing him to Sec. Clinton doesn't really fit here.
When will Gregg's confirmation hearing take place? I guess the GOP could game that as well to make sure he's on the side lines for awhile. Of course I expect Bonnie Newman to vote against anyways.
With Kyl and McCain not voting, with Gregg recusing himself and with the Coleman/Franken mess in the courts of Minnesota, you'd think the necessary vote get would be lowered accordingly. Instead of 50+1 votes, or 60 votes for cloture, you'd need 48 or 58 respectively.
February 4, 2009 11:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
Why do I get the impression the repugs are doing everything possible to shove Obama, the Democrats and the country into the abyss?
February 4, 2009 12:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Because you are an astute observer?
February 4, 2009 12:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
But it makes no sense. Once we go over, there's nothing but the pieces left. I told you so isn't enough to put it back together once its broken.
February 4, 2009 12:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
It makes perfect sense, if your goal is to make political gains in 2010. They don't give a shit about the country: they only care about their own political fortunes.
February 4, 2009 12:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
But at the rate things are dissolving, there won't be a country to govern in 2010.
February 4, 2009 12:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
They are trying to get a bill that stimulates the economy...all the other progressive wish list stuff needs to wait for the regular appropriations process. Do that and it passes with a majority of both parties and works.
February 4, 2009 12:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
That I can agree with. Pork has no business in the stimulus. Hell! If the stimilus were written correctly, it should address those areas the pork was aimed at covering.
February 4, 2009 12:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Take all of the fucking tax cuts out and it might work as a stimulus.
Republicans DO NOT WANT the economy to recover.
February 4, 2009 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
tax cuts = pork. Very simple to understand. Very simple to ban.
February 4, 2009 12:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Tax cuts for individuals and families = stimulus.
February 4, 2009 12:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
With the mountains of unemployed men and women receiving unemployment compensation, grossly under-employed or without an income, how does a tax cut benefit them? It doesn't! It only benefits those few who still have a job. The stimulus has to address both - tax cuts only address the employed.
February 4, 2009 12:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
"It only benefits those few who still have a job."
Dude, don't fall for the hype, there are still more employed than not employed...and will be untill the unemployment rate hits 51%. Second and extension of unemployment bens is also part of the stimulus. I was just stating tax cuts does not = Pork.
February 4, 2009 1:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sarge, since Bu$h has been in office I have been laid off 3 times - never been laid off before. Each time the job market was poor and salaries were always less. Currently, I'm grossly under-employed and the prospects are practically dim unless there is a stimulus. It's a pretty poor job market when a college education and one year of graduate work can only get $10k a year. So do you can see why tax-cuts would serve no purpose? The stimulus has to be about creating jobs and opportunities for businesses to start hiring people.
February 4, 2009 1:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just like global warming isn't about the temp today in Macon Ga. The economy isn't about your job. Tax relief for individuals and families will poor directly into the economy. Much faster than reaserch dollars for STD's and new computers at the Department of Agriculture.
February 4, 2009 1:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
the vast majority of the tax cuts in the current stimulus bill are for major banks to write down their losses, which will not create a single job or have any stimulative effect on the economy.
February 4, 2009 1:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
So if they have no income because they've lost their jobs, the rate that the zero income is not charged at is the key, SFC?
If not, WTF are you saying?
February 4, 2009 5:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
But there will still be elections, and the possibility of a) returning to Washington or b) going there for the first time.
The current Republicans in the House see everything in terms of how it will help them damage the president and Democrats. They're behaving like children. Why anyone would take them seriously after the last 8 years and after they sought out the advice of Joe the Plumber is simply inexplicable.
February 4, 2009 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Why do I get the impression if this were Feb 1942, the repugs would be arguing we should go to war against only the Japanese because of the attack on Pearl Harbor and not the Germans?
February 4, 2009 12:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
Dude...it was 2001...and it was the Dems that said "only go after the Taliban guys...they attacked us...you can't eliminate any other threats until they actually attack us."
February 4, 2009 12:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
FACT : Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11
FACT : Saddam and Osama were enemies
FACT : No WMDs
FACT : Iraq could only be govern by a strong leader capable of using whatever means possible to keep both Shia and Kurds in line - Gertude Bell 1921.
FACT : With Saddam in control of Iraq, Iran was kept at bay not sure if and when he would attack.
FACT : Since Saddam was killed, Iran has been exploiting its resources to advance their agenda to make an Islam Bomb.
Sounds to me like Bu$h should have paid more attention to history and regional intelligence about what would happen if Saddam were to be toppled. Best thing he could have done was to invade, look for WMD's then depart, leaving Saddam in power just to keep Iran in check.
February 4, 2009 1:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fact: None of that has anything to do with you Japan/Germany analogy.
February 4, 2009 1:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
ie..."Germany didn't have anything to do with Pearl Harbor!"
"A strong German Government prevented Soviet domination of Eastern Europe."
"After Hitler was killed millions died under Soviet domination."...
February 4, 2009 1:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
FACT : 2001 had nothing to do with 1942
February 4, 2009 1:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
True...just showing how easy it is to quarterback on Monday morning.
February 4, 2009 1:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Probably because it's an accurate impression.
February 4, 2009 12:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Because they are?
February 4, 2009 12:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
It makes me wonder if Obama's biggest mistake was trying too hard to bring the repugs to the center. They act as if they could care less about correcting the problems they have caused - the word irresponsibility comes to mind. So do we really need their input?
February 4, 2009 12:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
of course it was! you don't give up the farm first, and then head into negotiations about the farm! you sit down, and say 'screw y'all, no tax cuts'. then they say 'I need some tax cuts or I can't vote for this'. then you say 'ok, here are a few, now vote for it' and they either say yes or no. but at least you have something to bargain with.
Obama just gave up at the start, threw in tax cuts he knows full well are just a corporate givaway that will COST US ALL REVENUE, got nothing out of it, not a single Repug vote, and now has to bargain away things that are actually necessary. worst way he could have done this, really. it will be a valuable lesson for him. it better be, anyway!
February 4, 2009 1:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Man, I can just FEEL the bipartisanship in this move!
February 4, 2009 12:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
The GOP knows the stimulus will pass, there is no choice. The trick they're trying for is to get Obama to burn up political capital to get it passed. That's why they're poo-pooing it in the press and why there is leaks that it won't pass.
So far Obama is leaving it up to Congress to bang out package than he could then sign. Obama wants Congress to take ownership so they have a stake in it rather than it being Obama's Stimulus Plan.
February 4, 2009 12:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
If Obama burns his earned political capital pushing the stimulus, he won't have enough to get the health care issue passed. It's starting to look like he went a bridge too far. The Democrats in Congress need to take the reins on the issue and make it happen without Obama getting into the act.
February 4, 2009 12:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Exactly my point. Obama needs to stay out of it and tell Congress to get this done - it's their baby.
February 4, 2009 12:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
So far the prognosis is it will be still-born.
February 4, 2009 12:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Dems have been politically incompetent up to this point, therefore, leaving it up to Dems in Congress will just ultimately force him to burn more capital because something has to be done. That's the ultimate goal and that's what he's focused on.
The Dems are inept. And they're on the verge of really doing some damage to the President.
February 4, 2009 12:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
The big problem here is that Dems have never really learned to control the framing of the discussion. What the R's are really doing here is framing the debate as to be about the nitpicky details of the bill. With a bill this big, anyone can find something they don't like, so if you frame the debate on that, it becomes decidedly less popular.
What Dems need to do is re-frame the debate to what this is really about - getting a badly deteriorating economy moving again. If it does that no one will care if a few tenths of a percent of it went to something trivial. The R's are handing their ass to them in the PR war, just like always.
The guy who can do this best is Obama himself. Anyone else just gets drowned out by the Republican noise machine. Obama is the only one whose voice will be heard above it. The message is simple: This bill is not perfect, but if we screw around with it for six more months it still won't be perfect and another million jobs will be lost.
February 4, 2009 2:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Why is that? Seriously? They've been bad at this for quite awhile at this point. Sure, the cable media is conditioned to accept Republican talking points without much analysis, but it has been for some time. So why are the Democrats so consistently bad at public relations? Is it because they're reluctant to take a complex issue and boil it down into something that ultimately bears little resemblance to the real issue, in order to grab political points?
February 4, 2009 2:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't get it either. George Lakoff even wrote a couple of books about it. One thing is that once the Republican noise machine gets going it's hard to hear anything and that favors the R's. All they're doing is sowing confusion, and noise works to their advantage. That's why I say that Obama is the one person who can always be heard above it. I think it's reached the point where he's got to get out there and re-frame the debate back to what this is supposed to be all about. We're hemorrhaging jobs and the Republicans are yapping about trivia.
February 4, 2009 2:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
"The big problem here is that Dems have never really learned to control the framing of the discussion."
No, the Dems just haven't figured out how to lie to their base and get elected... considering what happened in 2006 and 2008, maybe The Truth was a better idea all along, it finally paid off.
February 4, 2009 6:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
I wonder if the framing thing all happens in those men's rooms where people have the wide stance.
February 4, 2009 6:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, dear... did my fingers do that?
February 4, 2009 6:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
I actually think Obama needs to take more ownership. I'm all for healthcare reform and believe it's way past due. But we have an urgent economic crisis that needs attention. Healthcare reform will take time. What we need now is stimulus that can be put into play today. I'm all for Congress having dual-ownership of this package, but I think Obama needs to take a more active role in selling and defending the package. And if there are things in there he can't defend, the WH needs to put pressure on the Dems in Congress to take it out and save the stuff for future appropriations and other bills. (I'm not saying the stuff they can't defend is necessarily bad - it's just that if you can't easily sell it as stimulus, you need to take it out of this package and get it some other way.)
As I've noted, even though Obama's approach has been pretty hands-off in terms of authorship, the media and the GOP is calling this "Obama's plan". That's not going to change. If you're going to be assigned ownership anyway, you may as well take on the responsibilities that go with ownership. I know Obama has had many meetings with Congress and has reached out to the GOP, probably more than they deserve. But he needs to provide a clearer vision of what should be in this package, what shouldn't be in there, and what it's going to achieve. And he needs to educate people on exactly what a stimulus package is, how a tax cuts only approach is not the answer and was actually the failed approach that led us to where we are today, and how this package is much different - both in target audience, goals, and structure - from the despised TARP.
February 4, 2009 12:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
I disagree that Obama needs to get his hands dirty.
This whole meltdown was brewed in the halls of Congress. There were rules, regulations and god-knows what else established in the 30's to keep such a meltdown in check. Our beloved Congress critters threw out the baby with the washwater. So its' their responsibility to pull their heads out of their rears and get this train wreck back on the tracks - they are the switchman that control the money. Obama can wish all he wants, but Congress is the only one with the power to make things happen and it will be on their terms, not his. They just need to start think about what's good for the country the country instead of their Party.
February 4, 2009 12:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't disagree with where the responsibility for our current situation lies. But people voted for Obama specifically because they thought he could breakdown those barriers, pressure Congress and the two parties to do what's right for the American people, propose ideas and legislation rather than allowing Congress to author the whole thing. Voters aren't going to accept, "Well, you made this mess, Congress...you need to clean it up", from Obama. They want him intimately involved. This is problem #1 for our nation. The President needs to take the lead. And what ultimately gets signed into law should be something he's proud of owning. But that's not going to happen if he stands on the sidelines.
February 4, 2009 12:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes. I can see where Obama is trying hard to steer both Democrats and repugs to the center so each side shares in the act of governing and legislating laws. Unfortunately, the repugs are crawling further into their niche and refusing to give any ground. Meanwhile, the whole country is about to fall into the abyss. By the time the repug emerge from their hole, it may be too late to stop the eventual slide. Obama needs to decide if trying to bring the repugs to the center is worth the economic pain it will cause the public. And its' that pain the repugs hope to blame Obama for, hoping the public has a short-term memory.
February 4, 2009 1:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
you really think gregg would've voted with the dems on this or anything else?
February 4, 2009 12:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hello, he doesn't want to give obama a black eye. That's the point.
February 4, 2009 12:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah ... he would have voted NO.
February 4, 2009 12:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes. Anything that would get, say, Susan Collins's vote would probably get his as well.
Face it, Obama screwed up here.
And to the "Obama should stay out of it" crowd- Obama won't HAVE any political capital if he fails to get the economy moving. He'll be a one-term President.
February 4, 2009 12:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
"And to the "Obama should stay out of it" crowd- Obama won't HAVE any political capital if he fails to get the economy moving. He'll be a one-term President."
Exactly. Right now, voters want Obama to fix the economy, to make them feel more secure in their financial future. It's the big reason why many folks voted for him in November - they saw him as the best option to fix the economy, to make the two parties work together to deliver that fix, to look out for the little guy. Yeah, a lot of people want us to end our involvement in Iraq and see a reduction in healthcare premium and stop global warming. But right now, they want to make sure they'll have a job tomorrow and, if they don't have that job or already lost that job, that they'll get the support they need while they're out of work and will have a realistic chance of getting back to work in the near future. Everything else takes a backseat right now.
And should we really trust Congress - this Congress - to take full ownership and get the job done by themselves? That's not a gamble I'd be willing to take.
February 4, 2009 12:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
because collins has been such a reliable "get" these last 8 years.
February 4, 2009 12:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
You want cloture on the stimulus bill or not? We won't get there with just Olympia Snowe, we need a couple other relatively moderate Republicans as well and Gregg would have been one of the likely target.
Personally I'd MUCH rather eliminate the filibuster and then do a better bill, but we all now that's not gonna happen.
February 4, 2009 12:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
re-read that sentence a few times, folks. Obama had damn well better personally push for this bill, and he should push for it to be better, and he should let everyone know there will be a round 2 bill following up on this one, improving it, and filling in any gaps. this bill should be all about him, and he should be all about it.
all of this commentary is largely beside the point. it all assumes that 60 votes are needed for anything to pass. not so, we'll have to force actual filibusters out of the Repugs, and then break the filibusters when they do it. if Reid & co. weren't such wusses, they would have done this years ago. they will have no choice now. sadly, I doubt Reid's seeing it that way, though.
February 4, 2009 1:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yank the fucking nomination. This guy is a flaming prick.
February 4, 2009 12:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
The country is in dire need of both Party's working together to keep us from falling into the abyss. It's not happening. I can find fault with President Obama in trying to get the repugs to migrate to the center. It was an admirable gesture, however, it's not going to happen with this motley crew of degenerates, so he needs to cut his losses and make an end-run around them to keep the economy from going under while the repugs vacillate.
February 4, 2009 12:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
We are in a much better position than you might think, from what you read. The bill will pass, and it will be a great success. The GOP is doomed for at least a generation if not forever. There is no way they come back or even make gains in 2010 or 2012 or 2014 or 2016 or really as far as the eye can see. Lighten up, people, President Obama knows what he is doing.
February 4, 2009 12:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm not sure I understand the 60 vote number. Is the rule for a cloture vote 60 votes or 60% of something? If it is 60%, 60% of what? As I understand it, there are now 99 senators. Can Gregg resign or recuse himself from the process and make it 98? Or is the 60 number rigid?
February 4, 2009 12:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's 60 votes period, not 60%. If only 65 senators show up, you still need 60 votes.
February 4, 2009 12:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is when I really start getting pissed off thinking about the Saxby Chambliss special election, and all the Democrats who stayed home on that one...
Those people need to take a long look in the mirror this morning... especially the ones hurting financially.
February 4, 2009 1:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's 3/5 of the total number of senators whether they vote or not, but it doesn't include vacancies. 3/5 of 99 is 59.4, so it still takes 60 votes. If Gregg were to resign, then until his replacement is named they would require 3/5 of 98 = 58.8 so they would need only 59 votes.
February 4, 2009 1:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Really? It doesn't include vacancies? It thought it was the total chamber, regardless of vacancies.
February 4, 2009 2:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Me too.
February 4, 2009 2:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wiki is your friend.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloture
February 4, 2009 2:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks. Duh. Learned something new today.
February 4, 2009 2:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Dems should block this nomination. There is plenty to object to without him not being an ally of the administration. WTF are his qualifications other than wanting to eliminate the department he is nominated to run?
February 4, 2009 12:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
After Geithner/Daschle/Killefer, the LAST thing the Dems is Congress should be doing is blocking a cabinet nominee from the leader of their party. And deciding to finally put their foot down with a Republican nominee, after confirming Geithner and signaling that they were almost all behind Daschle, would be a disaster. It's fine to question the logic of the Gregg nomination. But it's a done deal and unless something shady is revealed during the confirmation process, Dems in the Senate need to be fully Gregg as the nominee.
February 4, 2009 1:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
I agree, the appointment was incomprehensible. However, do we block the nomination, throw mud in Obama's eye? Claim that since the guy didn't convert from acting like a Republican in return for the cabinet position, we ditch him? We lose that fight.
He wasn't going to vote for the bill anyway. If the republicans try to block the recovery bill with a so-called filibuster, make them actually stand up and filibuster it. Are we afraid of what they might say? They will more likely come up with some pretty revealing quotes as they blather.
February 4, 2009 12:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
"If the republicans try to block the recovery bill with a so-called filibuster, make them actually stand up and filibuster it."
The Senate Dems should have started doing this on key legislation 2 years ago. It disgusts me that 60 votes has no become the requirement for anything to move forward. You want to filibuster, GOP, and explain why you're not letting legislation supported by a majority of the members of the Senate pass? Go ahead - you have the floor.
Why are Reid and the other Dem leaders so afraid of the filibuster threat?
February 4, 2009 1:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Lots and lots of hair on fire here.
February 4, 2009 12:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Lots of frustration.
Given that Obama won the election not doing half the things I was CONVINCED HE NEEDED TO DO, AND DO NOW!!!@#$!! I'm willing to acknowledge that Obama probably has a better handle on things than the breathless coverage of everything Obama seems to suggest.
However, I continue to be surprised and dismayed at how easily the Republicans have managed to seize the narrative and at how inept Democrats continue to appear to be.
February 4, 2009 1:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
He backed into the nomination despite a string of weak primary performances late in the season after banking an insurmountable delegate lead because his campaign people understood caucuses and Hillary's didn't, and then he beat the most inept Presidential candidate since Dole in a year that was completely toxic for all Republicans. Why people insist on claiming that this makes him some kind of demonstrated political genius I have no idea.
February 4, 2009 1:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, what was I thinking? An African-American with a last name that is very similar to the mastermind of 9/11, and a middle name of "Hussein", coupled with persistent rumors that he was a scary scary Muslim, combined with nearly three weeks of all Jeremiah Wright, all the time...against the most mavericky beloved Republican...damn it. Obama should have won by 120%. You're right. He was obviously incredibly lucky.
February 4, 2009 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fine, going on drinking your Koolaid while things continues to spiral downhill. I hope you enjoy the taste.
The Gregg pick is indefensible, period. And now it's become even more so, if that was possible. (What, a cabinet member who can't bring himself to support the President's #1 priority? WTF??) Sorry if reality conflicts with your rosy assessment of Obama's political instincts.
February 4, 2009 1:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm sorry you're routinely so bitter and angry.
February 4, 2009 1:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Gee, I don't know why the country going further down the crapper while a Dem President and large Dem congressional majorities are flailing around instead of acting would make anybody upset. We should all be grateful that we're so fucked.
What meds are you on, anyway? I want some.
February 4, 2009 1:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Funny.
February 4, 2009 1:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
You know, I truly don't LIKE feeling this way. In fact I really hate it, and on Inauguration Day I certainly didn't expect we'd end up here. But anybody who's not very worried right now about where the economy is headed, while Congress indulges in business as usual and Obama does whatever it is he thinks he's doing, is just not paying attention. Just wait for that Friday jobs report- it's going to be frightening.
February 4, 2009 2:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
And maybe, just maybe, Obama knows what that jobs report is going to say. And is letting Republicans dangle in the wind in the meantime.
I'm not a kool-aid drinking Obamabot, and all the exhortations to just "trust him, he knows what he's doing" and so forth make me a bit uncomfortable. But the fact remains that he did run a good campaign (in my opinion--one we evidently don't share) and I'm ok with looking at that as a positive sign for the future.
February 4, 2009 2:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Can someone please explain to me why in God's name our DEMOCRATIC president keeps tapping Republicans for his administration? This is the same party that crucified Bill Clinton, that marginalized and shut out Democrats every step of the way when they were in the majority, and that gave a total blank check to Bush even when doing so clearly meant endangering the country and eviscerating the Constitution. Is there a shortage of qualified DEMOCRATS to serve?
February 4, 2009 1:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
"...marginalized and shut out Democrats every step of the way when they were in the majority..."
Saying it doesn't make it so. Dems are the one changing the rules to "marginalized and shut out" the minority.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jan/07/house-faces-early-partisan-fight-over-rules/
February 4, 2009 1:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
You are really full of bullshit today.
Disappointing.
February 4, 2009 1:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
*uck off, useless troll.
February 4, 2009 1:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
...sometimes, it's good to know what the wingnuts are formulating in those little pea brains. But I have to agree, Sarge is one of those people like we all know, who's opinion equals truth regardless of substance or validity, and when they are proven wrong or debated skillfully, they would never change their mind no matter how clearly their premise is proven wrong. And they would certainly never acknowledge it, even if it did tweek their conscience.
But he does give us a glimpse into the seedy world of conservative group-think, and sometimes it is good to know which way the lemmings are leaning. With the herd being split up between the bigots, the CEO's and the fundamentalists, those lemmings don't know which cliff to throw themselves off of.
Sarge went with the CEO's, I think, that "we're fiscal conservatives" clan that got us so deep into debt with their profiteer's war. The same clan that bailed out the billionaires, but refuses to help the middle class.
February 4, 2009 6:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Galatically stupid pick. He can't shi* on them enough and they want him in the cabinet? Imbeciles. What are they thinking? Republicans see these bipartisan attempts as freebies to be politically expoited. They must be laughing their heads off at the Democrats poitical incompetence.
I wish the Democrats had the spines to block this pick, but they don't even have the spines to stand up to the discredited Republican minority.
February 4, 2009 1:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Galatically stupid..."
LOL...did you see "A Few Good Men" last weekend too?
February 4, 2009 1:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
We are seeing Obama's worst political move yet. Really, one of his few particularly bad choices. You just can't go around promising a new political culture while also embracing people like Tom Daschle. and why on earth would Obama want him, a many who has been paid millions by the insurance industry, to try to oversee it? this is very, very basic shit here.
but the full amount of blunder here is pretty shocking. opportunity to pick up a Senate seat - blown. opportunity to pick up a 'yes' vote on the stimulus bill - blown. opportunity to have a useful person at the head of Commerce - very, very blown. as in, the guy voted to eliminate the department and doesn't believe there should be a minimum wage. his "economic philosophy" is what most of us call 'crazy talk' - and now he's in charge of commerce at the federal level. amazing.
February 4, 2009 1:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Forget it. WIthdraw the nomination.
Seriously. DoesGregg think there is a conflict of interest here? Is he a senator or a mouse? He's nuts. If we cannot appoint a Democrat in his place and we cannot get Gregg to vote for Obama's legislation, then let's move on with another Commerce Secretary. This is crazy. We need to govern -- and these silly games aren't going to get anyone health care or a job or child care. Let's move through this.
February 4, 2009 1:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just a silly question, but while this is bad nooz for the prospects of securing another Repub to vote with the Dems, why is it not equally good nooz for depriving Repubs of a vote they need to successfully filibuster?
February 4, 2009 2:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Gregg pick up is bearing fruit already!
February 4, 2009 2:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Jeebus. Even with a Dem President, a Dem House AND a Dem Senate, the Republicans still seem to call the shots! It's truly pathetic.
The Gregg appointment is a mistake. Contrary to anything he might say, he hasn't the slightest interest in working with Obama and Dems. He will simply be a mole. None of the Republicans do, and the sooner Obama and the Dems open their eyes and realize this and basically say "F 'em", the better off we all will be. Unfortunately I see no signs of that happening.
February 4, 2009 2:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
"while his nomination is being considered by his former Senate colleagues."
Former?
February 4, 2009 2:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Gregg's ploy is worse than a no vote. Were he to resign following an expedited confirmation, the vacant seat together with MN's vacant seat would mean that the cloture vote would require 59, not 60 votes pending Ms. Newman's swearing in. By continuing to occupy the seat until after the stimulus vote occurs, he keeps the cloture requirement at 60.
February 4, 2009 2:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
If the issue really were just "not voting while my nomination is pending" the solution would have been simple - wait a week before nominating him. But I think Gregg told Obama he wouldn't vote for the stimulus, and rather than have that fiasco on his hands they announced the nomination and Gregg says he won't vote while it's pending. Problem is, if that's correct, no one played hardball - sit the mother down and tell him he gets Commerce and gets to play Mr. Entitlement Reform IF he votes for the stimulus, then gets nominated. No deal, no play.
I was under the obviously MISTAKEN impression that that was how they did business in Chicago....
February 4, 2009 2:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Obama people should by now easily have the votes, and if they'd done their job right, they shouldn't be worrying about one Senator.
That said, I see less and less reason why this status-quo (dare I say it?) -lout should hold a cabinet position in the Barack Obama Administration. Party first, like they say.
February 4, 2009 5:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
This blog reminds me of the 111th Congress; a clear majority of mostly polite, very smart progressives, with a much smaller number of blowhard conservatives who think they are smarter because they blow harder.
...it also reminds me of the civil war; conservative southern millionaires upholding a profane status quo, progressive everyday northerners forcing them to end slavery by the sheer weight of popular opinion and righteous freedom.
Here's hoping this charade ends soon.
And if the Republicans and their deaf-dumb-blind defenders think this is gaining votes for 2010, they are forgetting how badly they need the common vote. They were glad to help out their billiojnaires, but now that it is going to "The People" they balk as if someone is stealing something from them.
They will never win another election if they depend on only the wealthy to get them elected. But they are quite blatantly trashing the common folks, after they protected the CEO's.
And just reading this particular blog, it sounds like most of "them" still believe they are superior to their fellow Americans. Especially the ones who might lose their jobs.
February 4, 2009 5:54 PM | Reply | Permalink