Whole Foods CEO John Mackey says he knows why so many people hate him after his August op-ed opposing President Obama's health care reform goals.
"People try to size you up for what team your on," he told the editors of the Libertarian magazine Reason in an hour-long interview last month. "If you're on their team they love you and if you're on the other team they hate you."
Mackey then divulges what team he's on. "I voted for Bob Barr," he said when asked who he supported for president in 2008. Barr, a former GOP representative, was the Libertarian nominee. "I liked Ron Paul, but he didn't get the Republican nomination, regretfully."
Mackey founded the grocery chain synonymous with progressive politics in Austin in 1978. But in his Wall Street Journal op-ed in August, Mackey alienated some of his customers by slamming current Democratic health care reform efforts as moving America "much closer to a government takeover of our health care system."
Mackey describes himself as a "capitalist" and says the idea has gotten a bad rap since it defeated Communism during the Cold War.
"We won, but people didn't come to love capitalism," he said. "People are always attacking it for being greedy and selfish and only caring about money."
Mackey says young people are "drawn away" from capitalism because of the attacks.
"We've created this wall -- on the one hand we believe not-for-profits and government are motivated by this deeper purpose: public service," he said. "And then on the other side of this wall, we have corporations and businesses and we believe they're motivated strictly by selfishness and greed."
Watch Reason's abridged version of the interview:

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eric the red
October 19, 2009 5:08 PM
Keep digging, jackass, keep digging.
As for me, zero visits to Whole Foods since the op-ed, even though it is the closest store to me.
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Joemama
October 20, 2009 10:37 AM in reply to eric the red
Amen, Eric the Red! I will NOT shop at Whole Paychecks, ever, you have to take out a fucking loan to shop there for a week's groceries. Mackey doesn't have to worry about health care because he is a billionaire. His Whole Paychecks employees have to pay a very high deductible before they reap a red cent from WP health care plan, he conveniently fails to mention this when pitching his company's plan, a young transitory workforce, people who won;t stay long and can't afford their deductibles, a WIN WIN for Mackey.
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Signalman
October 19, 2009 5:17 PM
We drive right by Whole Foods and go another ten or twelve miles to get to Trader Joe's. And Whole Foods isn't all that close to our house to start with.
Love their produce, but hate the jackass that runs their show.
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Numbersguy
October 19, 2009 5:43 PM
Will NOT ever shop at Whole Paycheck again. Not ever. Nope.
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BluGrass
October 19, 2009 5:52 PM
Thank you, John Mackey! I'm saving so much money since I stopped buying anything at Whole Foods. I used to go pretty routinely, but then I read your comments this summer against health care reform. Haven't spent a cent with you since, John.
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Numbersguy
October 19, 2009 5:56 PM in reply to BluGrass
I really wonder what the impact of all of these decisions is on WF. It must be hurting them.
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BluGrass
October 19, 2009 6:05 PM in reply to Numbersguy
Yeah, who knows. And heck, the Tea-Baggers may start flooding Whole Foods 'cause Mackey's just their kinda guy.
But whether WF profits or suffers, they've lost my business forever. For me, it's not so much about punishing them as it is about what's right and what's wrong. Mackey's ideas are just plain wrong and un-American. He can put his overpriced endives right back where the sun don't shine.
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EH
October 20, 2009 2:38 AM in reply to Numbersguy
There's a new WF in my neighborhood and they're running a big "I Love Whole Foods" ad campaign across San Francisco, complete with posters in shop windows and full-page ads in the weekly papers.
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sandylillie
October 19, 2009 5:56 PM
We used to shop regularly at Whole Foods. Now I feel guilty when I have to go there for a couple of items I can't find anywhere else. But we used to shop there for most things, 2 or 3 times/week. Now we shop for just a few item once a month. I feel badly for the people who work there, but I just can't support an organization headed up by an outspoken opponent of making health care available to everyone who needs it. No matter how sincerely deluded he may be...
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The Old Grouch
October 19, 2009 6:07 PM in reply to sandylillie
Which raises a very good point: Sincerity, no matter how deeply felt, is never an excuse for being wrong.
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Powkat
October 19, 2009 6:02 PM
Yes, John, non-profits are motivated by service. I work at a non-profit and unlike the 20 years I spent in corporate America, I come to work every day knowing that not only am I not adding to the misery in the world, I actually do some good now and then.
Whole Foods doesn't do well in Portland. We have our own called New Seasons: better food, more local produce, meat and seafood and very involved in the community.
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TM
October 19, 2009 6:58 PM
Let him sell organic food to his libertarian and capitalist brethren. This shouldn't hurt Whole Foods at all. Think about all the organic food stalls at Ron Paul events.
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The Commenter Formerly Known as NCSteve
October 19, 2009 7:12 PM
Jesus, just when I was getting to where I could stand to go back in to the place again.
Keep it up you paultard fool. See how great you feel about capitalism when your shareholders finally have had enough of your seemingly deliberate efforts to piss off the customers you so carefully cultivate and fire your ass.
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cube3u
October 19, 2009 7:21 PM
I'll stop boycotting Whole Foods when their CEO is replaced.
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Redshift
October 19, 2009 7:28 PM
Yeah, it has nothing to do with you actively advocating for policies that are harmful to the life and health of others.
How much of an asshole do you have to be to talk about your political principles while dismissing those of anyone who disagrees with you as mere tribalism, with no connection to substance?
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traitorjoe
October 19, 2009 7:32 PM
I thought his interview for Treason magazine was delightful.
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TJ1
October 19, 2009 8:00 PM
What a simpleton pompous ass.
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midnight rambler
October 19, 2009 8:03 PM
I had thought his anti-HCR stance was just a keep-your-hands-off-my-money thing, to be expected from a CEO. But holy crap, he's a fan of Bob Barr??? I guess he's expecting no one who shops at WF reads Reason.
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GTFOOH
October 19, 2009 8:56 PM
I don't give a damn about how progressive he use to be. He's a nut now!
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xargaw
October 19, 2009 10:19 PM
Drive past Whole Foods also to shop at Trader Joes. Really like the TJ house brands which are a lot less expensive than Whole Foods stuff.
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Signalman
October 20, 2009 6:54 AM in reply to xargaw
Word. Those house brands are worth the extra drive. TJ's meats are kind of pricey, but we've just shifted our meat purchases to Costco and our budget has stayed intact.
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Lizskin
October 19, 2009 10:51 PM
What really got me about Mackey's comments on health reform is that he seems honestly to believe that those who do have access to health care are more deserving of health care, by virtue of being successful capitalists, or some such claptrap.
Libertarianism can often sound like old-time Puritanism; in other words, God rewards his faithful, and therefore material success is a sign of God's favor. The winners have never lacked for justification of the righteousness of their success, no matter how clearly you can show them the tilt of the playing field.
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TJ1
October 19, 2009 11:19 PM in reply to Lizskin
The corollary to this is that it's not good to interfere in God's judgement to reward his chosen and to withhold his rewards from those who are not the chosen of God.
In other words, who are we to help those that God has already shown disfavor to. What right do we have to interfere with God's will by helping the poor.
This is why universal health coverage is such an evil idea; it messes with God's grand plan.
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TM
October 20, 2009 1:03 AM in reply to TJ1
I lived through the Cold War too. What about Universal Healthcare reminds you of the battle between the USSR and the US?
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Richard Stands
October 19, 2009 11:35 PM
I've read his article, listened to the full interview at Reason, and I like what I read and heard.
Having lived through most of the Cold War, I'll take freedom over government-enforced attempts at equal outcome any day.
I still shop at Whole Foods, and have started shopping there more often as a show of support.
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Kinkistyle
October 20, 2009 12:25 AM in reply to Richard Stands
Many liberal baby boomers ALSO lived through the Cold War. No kidding. Its true!
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Richard Stands
October 20, 2009 1:20 AM in reply to Kinkistyle
No doubt :-)
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addicted
October 20, 2009 2:34 AM in reply to Richard Stands
Except, when the government takeover is not a government takeover.
The government is laying ground rules, for the most part, (and preferably offering an option for insurance, not healthcare).
If you want to see what government healthcare, go see England. That is a government takeover of healthcare (but shockingly, its still better and more popular than healthcare here).
Right now, for your "freedom" (not any different from the freedom you would have if the healthcare bill passes) you are basically at the mercy of a couple of paper-pushers at your favored insurance agency, that spends a significant chunk of money you pay them trying to figure out how they can get out of reimbursing you.
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Richard Stands
October 20, 2009 4:10 AM in reply to addicted
The current offering is well over 1000 pages of ground rules. Include the inevitable unintended consequences, trillions in expense added to an already bankrupt federal government, massive increases in central bureaucratic control over health care choices, and a public option which will eventually drive competing providers from the field using tax funding and coverage requirements, and I see disaster looming. We'd be replacing paper-pushers in insurance companies with paper-pushers in government offices. Neither is very responsive, but the latter wouldn't even fear competition or word-of-mouth.
However, I understand and accept that others may see this as a step in the right direction. Long experience with government solutions convinces me otherwise. From my perspective, Mr. Mackey's proposals would provide more relief to more citizens. Have you read them?
Government is a good tool for protecting our rights to live in freedom. It's proven to be a horrible tool to deliver goods and services. Call for the government to help citizens redress fraudulent insurance practices, and I'm with you. Call for the government to provide insurance, and I'll oppose it.
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Signalman
October 20, 2009 7:00 AM in reply to Richard Stands
Even if the current system were to be replaced wholesale by a governmentally-imposed healthcare system, I'd still rather have government calling the shots than allow companies that actually incent their employees to deny care to continue running things.
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famished
October 20, 2009 1:13 AM
We sold our stock in the company after his first editorial. This interview just reinforces our decision. We won't and don't shop there any longer. Why would he alienate his base?
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addicted
October 20, 2009 2:28 AM
The problem is that this guy has Bush vision. Its either unabashed capitalism, or you are anti-capitalist and a commie...
He doesn't realize that the best days of American capitalism were fueled by the government, and came during a time when Americe was far more "communist" than now, with a lot more social protection.
Also, many of the achievements of American capitalism can be directly traced back to American government investments (in technology, education, and infrastructure). Capitalism needs the government to step in where it fails, because unfortunately, there is no "one true solution to rule them all". Different approaches work best for different problems.
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markkraft
October 20, 2009 8:12 AM
John Mackey's propaganda about his "great" health benefits for employees is wearing thin.
Employees have to pay the first couple hundred dollars a year in health costs before getting a single dollar of help. Since most of their employees are young anyway, that means that for most of their employees, the amount of health benefits per year received is... nothing at all!
Worst still, employees choose not to schedule regular physicals or dental exams, because if they did what any other health insurance policy would consider a very basic level of preventative medicine, they'd have to pay for all of it out of pocket, on substandard, non-union wages.
People who work for Whole Foods usually aren't able to save much while they work there, so affording preventative medicine is impractical and unjustifiable. As a result, preventable health problems go undiagnosed and untreated, and dental problems, rather than getting caught early, oftentimes result in more expensive dental work.
Whole Foods is bad for its employee's health! They'd get far more in salary and benefits per year -- and basic preventative medicine -- if they unionized.
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tmccarthy0
October 20, 2009 9:09 AM
The constant whining from neo-Confederates is grating on my nerves. Their battle cry is "They don't like me because I am a conservative", and he goes further with his "victim rant", "I, I, I", he stuttered, "I voted for Bob Barr". Poor Mr. Mackey, he is simply an old guy, he has no idea who his customers represent anymore, because he outgrew them. Mr. Mackey doesn't realize his customers are latte sipping, Volvo Driving (okay subaru driving), Liberals some of whom are from the left coast! Oh Mr. Mackey, I never hear anyone from the Nordstrom family weighing in on politics, why do you think that is? Yes the Nordstrom family, far smarter than Mr. Mackey, they might be republicans or libertarians or democrats, but I wouldn't know, because they know better than to insult more than half of their customer base. It seems Mr. Mackey has no clue. Oh well, it is PCC all the way for me!!!!
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martis
October 20, 2009 9:13 AM
TJ's all the way!!
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politicjock
October 20, 2009 10:05 AM
I haven't shopped at WF since he op-ed and I've saved a ton of money in the process. Go Trader Joe's.
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calguy
October 20, 2009 1:25 PM
I echo the remarks above. Have not shopped at WF since Mackey's august salvo, and have found as a result a local organic grocery store which is excellent, saved a lot of money, and felt good about sticking it to Mackey.
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