
A White House official tells TPMDC President Obama will attend the climate talks in Copenhagen on Dec. 9. The trip coincides with Obama's acceptance of the Nobel Peace Prize in Oslo.
In addition to the president's address, the White House will send a large delegation, including Obama's "Green Cabinet" who aim to "maximize" chances of success at Copenhagen.
White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs told reporters the move would "give momentum" to the U.S. position on climate talks.
EPA administrator Carol Browner told reporters he would lay out clear goals for cutting carbon emissions, in metrics that are "fairly similar" to the bill which passed the House and what is being considered by the Senate.
Browner said Obama will lay out a U.S. goal "in the range of" cutting emissions by 17 percent by 2020, by 30 percent by 2025 and by 42 percent by 2030. Obama's overall goal is an 83 percent reduction by 2050, she said.
Browner said the cost of the carbon reductions is about $173 per family annually, starting in 2020.
Reporters asked her about British emails suggesting climate change effects were trumped up.
At first she said, "I've read them I don't know that I have a reaction," but pressed further, she said she'd rather trust 2,500 scientists than some "naysayers."
Those scientists "agree the problem is real," she said.
Silence
November 25, 2009 10:27 AM
Of course he is.
Just one question for oppressives. What do you folks plan on eating when this bust out is complete?
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dswx
November 25, 2009 11:00 AM in reply to Silence
When do you plan to admit you do not have a clue about the science behind global warming, the fact that it is unequivocal, how science has *always* been conducted and what the scientific method is? Failure to do so will just prove you regurgitate what others tell you to think. The entire "hacking" incident is a huge red herring that has bearing on the data and the science. Whatsoever. Flaunting your ignorance proves that as well.
Read and actually try to learn from actual climate scientists:
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2009/11/the-cru-hack/
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2009/11/the-cru-hack-context/
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dswx
November 25, 2009 11:16 AM in reply to Silence
Jeff Masters at The Weather Underground (http://www.wunderground.com/blog/JeffMasters/comment.html?entrynum=1389) really says it best:
“You’ll hear claims by some contrarians that the emails discovered invalidate the whole theory of human-caused global warming. Well, all I can say is, consider the source. We can trust the contrarians to say whatever is in the best interests of the fossil fuel industry. What I see when I read the various stolen emails and explanations posted at Realclimate.org is scientists acting as scientists–pursuing the truth. I can see no clear evidence that calls into question the scientific validity of the research done by the scientists victimized by the stolen emails. There is no sign of a conspiracy to alter data to fit a pre-conceived ideological view. Rather, I see dedicated scientists attempting to make the truth known in face of what is probably the world’s most pervasive and best-funded disinformation campaign against science in history. Even if every bit of mud slung at these scientists were true, the body of scientific work supporting the theory of human-caused climate change–which spans hundreds of thousands of scientific papers written by tens of thousands of scientists in dozens of different scientific disciplines–is too vast to be budged by the flaws in the works of the three or four scientists being subject to the fiercest attacks”.
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Lalo35adm
November 25, 2009 11:17 AM
Realclimate.org has been repeatedly quoted in the hacked emails as being in the pocket of the political activists from CRU, who also called themselves "scientists".
From the hacked emails:
"I wanted you guys to know that you're free to use RC in any way you think would be helpful. Gavin and I are going to be careful about what comments we screen through.... We can hold comments up in the queue and contact you about whether or not you think they should be screened through or not, and if so, any comments you'd like us to include.
Think of RC as a resource that is at your disposal.... We'll use our best discretion to make sure the skeptics don't get to use the RC comments as a megaphone"
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/11/24/the_fix_is_in_99280.html
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The Reluctant Conspiracy Theorist
November 25, 2009 12:49 PM
How perfect. The president is attending Climate Talks based on fraudulent data and picking up the now meaningless Nobel Peace prize. All the while spewing the dreaded carbon through his airplane travel.
The scientists at CRU apparently don't know that the scientific method ENDS with a conclusion derived from observation and data. It does not START with a conclusion (man-made global warming) and then make the observations and data fit the conclusion.
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JohnBTipton
November 25, 2009 1:49 PM
Wackos on TM. Neat.
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Why oh why
November 25, 2009 7:35 PM
1. Given that the Senate hasn't passed anything yet, is Obama going to Copenhagen only to weaken the future treaty and protect corporate interests? After all, that is what he did at the G20 when he nixed the real regulatory reforms suggested by Angela Merkel, to protect Wall Street.
2. I don't know why global warming science drives right-wingers into such a frenzy, as illustrated above. Do they think that if they repeat "data" and "proof" enough times in their posts, it will make them look smarter, or at least not complete flat-Earthers? Sorry science doesn't work like that, get a PhD and publish articles in top publications if you want to influence the scientific debate.
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The Reluctant Conspiracy Theorist
November 26, 2009 2:31 PM in reply to Why oh why
Science does work that way. That is if you want to find the truth and not just support an agenda. You don't massage your data to fit your already decided upon conclusion. Oh...sorry...let me put that in flat-earth parlance so you can understand. Global Warming/Climate Change is not science, it is a political agenda.
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Odel Roo
November 27, 2009 8:05 AM
hmmmm....
"In two other programs, briffa_Sep98_d.pro and briffa_Sep98_e.pro, the "correction" is bolder by far. The programmer (Keith Briffa?) entitled the "adjustment" routine “Apply a VERY ARTIFICAL correction for decline!!” And he or she wasn't kidding. Now IDL is not a native language of mine, but its syntax is similar enough to others I'm familiar with, so please bear with me while I get a tad techie on you.
Here's the "fudge factor" (notice the brash SOB actually called it that in his REM statement):
yrloc=[1400,findgen(19)*5.+1904]
valadj=[0.,0.,0.,0.,0.,-0.1,-0.25,-0.3,0.,-0.1,0.3,0.8,1.2,1.7,2.5,2.6,2.6,2.6,2.6,2.6]*0.75 ; fudge factor
These two lines of code establish a twenty-element array (yrloc) comprising the year 1400 (base year, but not sure why needed here) and nineteen years between 1904 and 1994 in half-decade increments. Then the corresponding "fudge factor" (from the valadj matrix) is applied to each interval. As you can see, not only are temperatures biased to the upside later in the century (though certainly prior to 1960), but a few mid-century intervals are being biased slightly lower. That, coupled with the post-1930 restatement we encountered earlier, would imply that in addition to an embarrassing false decline experienced with their MXD after 1960 (or earlier), CRU's "divergence problem" also includes a minor false incline after 1930.
And the former apparently wasn't a particularly well-guarded secret, although the actual adjustment period remained buried beneath the surface.
Plotting programs such as data4alps.pro print this reminder to the user prior to rendering the chart:
IMPORTANT NOTE: The data after 1960 should not be used. The tree-ring density records tend to show a decline after 1960 relative to the summer temperature in many high-latitude locations. In this data set this "decline" has been artificially removed in an ad-hoc way, and this means that data after 1960 no longer represent tree-ring density variations, but have been modified to look more like the observed temperatures.
Others, such as mxdgrid2ascii.pro, issue this warning:
NOTE: recent decline in tree-ring density has been ARTIFICIALLY REMOVED to facilitate calibration. THEREFORE, post-1960 values will be much closer to observed temperatures then (sic) they should be which will incorrectly imply the reconstruction is more skilful than it actually is. See Osborn et al. (2004).
Care to offer another explanation, Dr. Jones?
Gotcha
Clamoring alarmists can and will spin this until they're dizzy. The ever-clueless mainstream media can and will ignore this until it's forced upon them as front-page news, and then most will join the alarmists on the denial merry-go-round.
But here's what’s undeniable: If a divergence exists between measured temperatures and those derived from dendrochronological data after (circa) 1960, then discarding only the post-1960 figures is disingenuous, to say the least. The very existence of a divergence betrays a potential serious flaw in the process by which temperatures are reconstructed from tree-ring density. If it's bogus beyond a set threshold, then any honest man of science would instinctively question its integrity prior to that boundary. And only the lowliest would apply a hack in order to produce a desired result.
And to do so without declaring as such in a footnote on every chart in every report in every study in every book in every classroom on every website that such a corrupt process is relied upon is not just a crime against science, it’s a crime against mankind."
"Bottom line: CRU's evidence is now irrevocably tainted. As such, all assumptions based on that evidence must now be reevaluated and re-adjudicated. And all policy based on those counterfeit assumptions must also be reexamined."
I guess the BIG question is... how much policy or planning is based on CRU's findings?
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Odel Roo
November 27, 2009 8:11 AM
Funny a big story like these "hacked Emails" and CRU and it doesn't even get a mention on the front page of TPM. I'm just sayin...
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Odel Roo
November 27, 2009 10:39 AM
Funny a big story like these "hacked Emails" and CRU and it doesn't even get a mention on the front page of TPM. I'm just sayin...
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