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Lieberman: Even Unpullable Trigger Is An 'Irritant' That I Will Filibuster
Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT)
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Since the details of a looming public option compromise have begun to leak out, Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) has reiterated his opposition to a triggered public option--which is reportedly part of a new health care agreement. I asked him today whether he still intends to filibuster, even if the Congressional Budget Office says it's unlikely to be filled. He drew a line in the sand.
"I've told them that I can't support a trigger--no, actually, to be more explicit: If they say that it's unlikely to be [pulled] then it's unnecessary," Lieberman said. "It's an irritant. And I keep saying to my colleagues: the underlying bill, that I would say 60 of us in the caucus support, that is, the parts that we support in the underlying bill, are so full of progress--let's get that done, and stop trying to squeeze in things that some of us, respectfully, just won't accept."
The trigger being considered would be pulled, according to a Senate aide briefed on the compromise, if private health insurers, managed by the federal government, do not offer nation-wide non-profit plans starting in 2014. If pulled, it would create a national public option. The measure was added to the agreement at the last moment at the insistence of Sen. Russ Feingold (D-WI). But it may still prove an obstacle to passage of the health care bill.
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The Decider
December 10, 2009 3:11 PM
Even a bill with no public option should be filibustered, Joe, because someone could add a public option to it someday. Are you going soft, Joe? I'll get Sarah on your case if you are!
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VictorLH
December 10, 2009 3:14 PM
Lieberman is a piece of shit who is hated in his state.
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dougom
December 10, 2009 5:39 PM in reply to VictorLH
Normally I prefer comments that are more eloquent, less caustic, less profane, but in the case of Lieberman, I think Victor has it exactly right. Indeed, I think one might add things like "attention whore," "liar," "hypocrite," "bought and paid for tool of the health insurance industry,' and the like.
It makes me ashamed that I was born in New London.
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fkaZk0sm0
December 10, 2009 3:16 PM
damn you party purifiers for pushing this loyal democrat out of the party!!
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Former Federal Employee
December 10, 2009 3:28 PM in reply to fkaZk0sm0
Would we still be at this point, if Ned Lamont hadn't run? Maybe. Hell, probably.
He won the race. You can demote him from his chairmanship, you can make sure he gets none of the earmarks for which he asks, and you can say mean, mean things about him in public. What you can't do is change his ability to vote however he wants.
I had hoped that he was holding out for something to bring back to the constituents in the reform bill, like Mary Landrieu, but it looks like he's the insurance companies' man to the last. It's too late to do anything except to get the most benefit for the most people we can, and try again when the next opportunity presents itself.
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Jyrinx
December 10, 2009 3:32 PM in reply to Former Federal Employee
If he thought his chairmanship were at stake, you bet your ass he'd change his tune. But he knows they'll never actually take away his toys, and that's why he has all the power.
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Former Federal Employee
December 10, 2009 4:15 PM in reply to Jyrinx
By obstructing the key piece of Democratic legislation, Lieberman knows that he's risking everything that the Majority Leader has the power to withhold, including his precious committee chairmanship.
If significant health care reform founders in the Senate, then Lieberman should expect that Reid will be forced to retaliate against him, or else Reid will have his leadership called into question by the caucus. If you can vote against the bill that will make or break Democratic chances in the midterm elections, then you've shown that you're too unreliable to reward. Lieberman will only vote against this bill if he's comfortable with losing his committee chairmanship, and probably all of his seniority for any purpose that matters if he caucuses with the Democrats.
If he votes against it, that means he's comfortable with it because his wife's salary makes him comfortable with it. And frankly, at his age, looking at almost-certain defeat in 2012, why wouldn't he take several million dollars and run?
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VictorLH
December 10, 2009 8:20 PM in reply to Former Federal Employee
Reid won't do anything and Lieberman knows it. Reid is the worst Majority Leader in Denate history and is headed for defeat on this bill and in his upcoming election.
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condew
December 10, 2009 5:52 PM in reply to Former Federal Employee
I think that after he kills reform, we should fund a series of adds in Connecticut or nation wide that ask "Did you lose a loved one due to lack of access to medical care? Senator lieberman sold your loved one out, killed them to protect his insurance buddies obscene profits. Maybe you should find Senator Lieberman and get even. He condemned someone you cared about to death."
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masanf
December 10, 2009 10:59 PM in reply to condew
And given the rising unpopularity of this bill as charted IN EVERY SINGLE POLL, people are not buying the "if you obstruct our terrible bill, you want people to die" bullsh*t.
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mepmep09
December 12, 2009 2:11 AM in reply to masanf
I don't think there is a bill yet. Could you provide a link to the proposed draft legislation you are talking about? For that matter, could you provide a link to some polls by reputable organizations that back up what you say regarding public opinion? Because my impression is quite the contrary, at least where reputable polling is involved.
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celldumceen
December 10, 2009 3:22 PM
I can't stand this guy! After this term his political career is over! If held today Lieberman would lose re-election huge!
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Xantar
December 10, 2009 3:22 PM
FUCK YOU, JOE!!
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Michael A
December 10, 2009 4:28 PM in reply to Xantar
Ditto.
Damn. I was going to post that. You beat me to it. That was my immediate thought when I read this.
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CityGuy
December 10, 2009 4:31 PM in reply to Michael A
Co-sign!
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rbeats
December 10, 2009 3:26 PM
Is that what your wife has told you to do Joe?
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ilovebacon
December 10, 2009 3:29 PM
From now on, all Senate votes should be held at sundown on Fridays.
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condew
December 10, 2009 6:05 PM in reply to ilovebacon
If we made a small rule change so it takes 40 Senators to filibuster rather than 60 Senators to stop a filibuster, you've got the solution to the Lieberman proble right there, vote late Friday night!
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masanf
December 10, 2009 11:03 PM in reply to condew
The Republicans have 40 Senators.
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ranger11
December 11, 2009 2:24 AM in reply to masanf
You know, you're real courageous! You wait about four hours to respond to somebody and the thread is already dead. Way to go!
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glogrrl
December 10, 2009 3:32 PM
Senator Lieberman (and I say that with reservation):
YOU are an irritant that should be filibustered. I pray the good people of Connecticut see the light and impeach you for treason to the people who voted for you......you have sold them out at every opportunity in order to vote as your Corporate Masters wished and lined your pockets with cash from the lobbyists who own you. You are a disgrace to all observant Jews in America.
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slb
December 10, 2009 5:06 PM in reply to glogrrl
Well, shoot, I just posted the same thing myself! Shoulda read farther into the thread...
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Paul Brand
December 10, 2009 3:32 PM
Joe Lieberman, you are a piece of shit.
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thomas1
December 10, 2009 4:36 PM in reply to Paul Brand
I believe this is a denegration of pieces of shit.
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jenesq
December 10, 2009 3:34 PM
He is such a douchebag. I'm an extremely strong supporter of Obama's consensus-building approach and all that, but Lieberman is just an "irritant" of no use whatsoever. He needs to be stripped of every single Senate leadership position so he can while away his dwindling political career being the asshat obstructionist (who doesn't give a rat's ass what his constituents think) that he is...but in total irrelevance. Let him become a Republican...who cares!
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Vavasseur
December 10, 2009 3:35 PM
If this is what the filibuster gets us, then end the filibuster. I'd wager that even the threat of doing so would cause a bunch of Republicans to start compromising in earnest.
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masanf
December 10, 2009 11:10 PM in reply to Vavasseur
Yeah, let's just end the filibuster and decades of tradition because the Dems can't pass a shitty health care bill that an increasing amount of people don't want. If you thought now the Dems were gonna get killed in 2010, if you got rid of the filibuster the outrage would be so overwhelming, you would be lucky if the Democratic Caucus could fill a taxi cab after the midterms.
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pdxer
December 10, 2009 3:37 PM
I think it's obvious Lieberman has no intention of supporting a Democratic health care bill under any circumstances. He will always find a reason not to support it. The guy refused even to take part in the negotiations over the weekend, after all.
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ilovebacon
December 10, 2009 3:45 PM
Oh he'll support it. When the last remnant of the public option is removed. He wants to flex his little muscles. Sad thing is it will work. Good thing is the public option isn't that great anyway. Buying into Medicare is superior in most ways.
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The Decider
December 10, 2009 4:04 PM in reply to ilovebacon
Joe, you see, you just can't trust them! Buying into Medicare is a sort of public option. Filibuster it, Joe! The great thing is that by gitting democrat Senators like you and Ben, etc. to vote with us, we can claim to be bipartisan while the dems will get no Republican support so that means that they are partisan hacks!
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masanf
December 10, 2009 11:11 PM in reply to ilovebacon
Yeah, and he is starting to opppose that too. Oops.
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ilovebacon
December 11, 2009 10:18 AM in reply to masanf
Lieb is insatiable. It's time to realize that neither he nor Snowe can be trusted. Go for Collins, perhaps?
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sean
December 10, 2009 3:47 PM
Die Prinzessin und die Erbse.
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madmatt
December 10, 2009 3:48 PM
nice to see the bribes to you rwife paid off...shes a whore just like you!
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hey norm
December 10, 2009 3:52 PM
Lieberman (I-Aetna)
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stryder
December 10, 2009 3:57 PM
the trigger is *not meant* to be pulled. unpullability is the very essence of this "trigger". the trigger is an indefinite delay.
so this quote from joe merely makes plain this fact. the trigger is not meant to be pulled.
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The Decider
December 10, 2009 4:08 PM in reply to stryder
Having a gun pointed at you makes you nervous even if the trigger is not meant to be pulled. Instead of giving Congress the gun, let's give average Americans more guns. That's what our constitushion says. Besides, our senior citizens have made clear that they don't want anyone messing with their Medicare by creating some Govermint program. Joe, make them take their hands off the trigger!
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thomas1
December 10, 2009 4:40 PM in reply to The Decider
If I had only enjoyed the real Decider as much as I enjoy this one.
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John
December 10, 2009 4:09 PM
My God Lieberman can't go but a few days at a time before he has to open that piehole and spout off more of his idiotic, yet highly infuriating crap.
The Caucus needs to hold his feet to the fire for once or kick him the hell out.
Join the Facebook group "Loathing Lieberman"
http://loathinglieberman.com
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stryder
December 10, 2009 4:21 PM
guns aren't the only things that have triggers, decider, put your gun away
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Clavis
December 10, 2009 4:26 PM
You're all so mean to Joe. Don't you remember, he's with "us" on everything but the war?
("Us" being, of course, the insurance industry.)
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The Commenter Formerly Known as NCSteve
December 10, 2009 4:33 PM
Keep building up that bad karma Joe. Yeah, it takes 60 votes to pass a law in the age of extra-Constituional requirements imposed by an insane and intransigent minority, but it's only going to take 26 to toss your ass down the stairs of the caucus room and the votes are there for that, you swine. If you're neither vote no. 60 nor vote no. 50 come November, you're going to find out how popular you are over in the land of the Deminted.
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masanf
December 10, 2009 11:05 PM in reply to The Commenter Formerly Known as NCSteve
So when the Democrats were fiibustering multiple judicial nominees for the first time in history and blocked the Bush Social Security reform, you naturally were complaining about the unconstitutional nature of that weren't you? Yeah, sure you were.
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Ethan
December 10, 2009 4:43 PM
I'm having violent fantasies right now. Is that natural?
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Kuyleh
December 10, 2009 9:55 PM in reply to Ethan
Unsure, really. But I can assure you that you're not the only one.
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mamiller
December 10, 2009 4:44 PM
Just another reason to wish Gore had won in 2000
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Moloko+
December 10, 2009 4:52 PM
Joe is not a Democrat and should just move over to the Republican party. That is where people that think like him go. Healthcare for all Americans is a Democratic value. It is not a Republican value. Preservation of insurance company profits is a Republican value. I expect he will have to change his views on some other issues to pass the Republican litmus test. He clearly fails the Democratic litmus test. A test I am very proud of.
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masanf
December 10, 2009 11:13 PM in reply to Moloko+
You're right, he's not a Democrat. That is why he has an "I" behind his name.
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OhioMan
December 11, 2009 7:26 AM in reply to masanf
How embarrassing. I assumed the "I" stood for "Idiot".
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willia451
December 10, 2009 5:00 PM
We have the voters of CT to thank for this POS. They've not only screwed themselves, but the entire nation right along with them.
We've waited 40+ years for this time, when real HC reform for everyone could be a possibility. And this POS pulls down his pants and shits all over us. For what? To stroke his own ego and protect his HC Insurance Industry masters.
CT voters should pay for a national tv ad spot titled "Apology to the American People for out POS Senator".
Maine voters should do the same relative to Collins and Snowe.
I mean, you expect this kind of thing from people elected to the Senate out of states like Texas, Wyoming, Mississippi, or South Carolina. But CT and Maine??? WTF??
What was going through people's minds when they voted for this guy? Anything? Anything at all?? No???
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slb
December 10, 2009 5:12 PM in reply to willia451
National Democrats played their part, too. If some of them had backed Lamont more enthusiastically, we might actually have that 60th vote.
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agio
December 10, 2009 9:27 PM in reply to slb
No doubt. In some sense, this started in 06 when Reid made a strategic calculation to tacitly back his old buddy instead of the Democratic nominee.
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The Decider
December 10, 2009 5:29 PM in reply to willia451
Don't say nothing mean about Texas, boy. As governor, I executed people for saying mean things about Texas. (Actually, having a sense of humor is the only way to survive in Texas. Believe it or not, there are a lot of progressive people here--just not quite enough).
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slb
December 10, 2009 5:05 PM
Lieberman is an irritant. So, Joe, why don't you just go...filibuster...yourself?
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Powkat
December 10, 2009 5:16 PM
Why am I not surprised. Senator Hartford Blue Cross is never going to be for anything that will lower his income. Because you know, being a senator is all about Joe.
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AnswerFrog
December 10, 2009 5:30 PM
This is just proof that dealing with him is a waste of time. He is negotiating in bad faith. I wouldn't turn my back on this reptile.
How come people in his state -- who are responsible for inflicting this POS on the rest of us -- don't do anything about. Isn't there anyway they can have a recall election or referendum, a la Gray Davis?? My god, what have you CT folks done!
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smarish
December 10, 2009 6:42 PM
Loserman is obviously the one that knows about 'irritable' things. He certainly is one.
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daveminnj
December 10, 2009 6:49 PM
i love al, i always will, but has he ever owned up to how much harm he
caused by picking leiberman?
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decisivemoment
December 10, 2009 7:33 PM
He's Aetna's sockpuppet and he'll keep moving the goalposts to the end. And he's a bitter, nasty old man.
It's time for the Democrats to view him as a lost vote -- there's no point in dealing with him.
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rambler american
December 10, 2009 8:09 PM
Who would know more about irritants than Holy Joe? Kinda like Hemorrhoids.
Wikipedia:
The anatomical term "hemorrhoids" technically refers to "'Cushions of tissue filled with blood vessels at the junction of the rectum and the anus."
There is a picture of Joe here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemorrhoid
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dustbunny44
December 10, 2009 9:19 PM
Joe Lieberman is posterchild for the need for universal mental healthcare.
Someone should take away the keys to his senate seat before he disables or kills tens of thousands of Americans per year.
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OhioMan
December 11, 2009 7:23 AM
I wish this guy would just GO AWAY. He's even more annoying than the typical right-wing wackos because he masqueraded as one of us for years, ultimately helping us "lose" an election we actually won. And now he has become a pissy, self-important republican nut job. Again, when will this wretched little nothing of a man GO AWAY? Please God! Take him!
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ilovebacon
December 11, 2009 10:21 AM
I will ask again: WHAT ideas do people here have for getting healthcare reform through with 60 votes? Any? I hate Lieberputz too. But right now he's holding the bill hostage and nobody knows how to get anything passed without him.
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agio
December 11, 2009 12:45 PM in reply to ilovebacon
Nobody knows for sure, but:
(a) get Snowe, Voinovich, and/or Collins to agree not to filibuster
(b) make it clear to Lieberman that participating in a filibuster will lead to him being kicked out of the caucus, for good
(c) pursue reconciliation
Obviously no one knows what exactly Reid is doing, or whether he is pursuing one or all three of these options.
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ilovebacon
December 12, 2009 2:03 PM
All three in that order? Those three moderates would have to be bought off. I'd even promise them Lieb's chair if they agreed to not filibuster.
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