
MoveOn has been very involved in the health care debate with fundraising emails and pushes against conservative Democrats who would filibuster the legislation, but now the progressive group is asking its members to fight the bill as a "massive giveaway to the insurance companies."
MoveOn asked members to sign a petition asking progressive senators such as Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) to block the bill unless it's improved.
"America needs real health care reform--not a massive giveaway to the insurance companies. Senator Bernie Sanders and other progressives should block this bill until it's fixed," the petition reads, later naming Sens. Roland Burris (D-IL) and Russ Feingold (D-WI) as other progressives who might be swayed.
"But there's enormous pressure from all sides to pass a bill quickly, no matter how weak it is," the email says. "Let's show Bernie and other progressives that we're counting on them to block this version of the bill--and we'll get their backs if they do."
The MoveOn team says there is still a chance to "win" the health care fight and said the House bill is strong and has "a real public option."
Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 3:24 PM
Funny how perspectives change when you realize what you will end up with. Not too long ago, the House version was watered down piece of nothing - now it's "real". Not too long ago Obama was a sell out and stupid for courting "President" Snowe - now people are actually asking, "what about Snowe?"
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 3:40 PM in reply to Viva!America!
moveon applauded the house version.
they even attacked reps against it:
http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/2009/11/moveon-attacks-dems-who-voted-against-health-care.html
With the spice comes some sugar: Later this week, MoveOn.org is planning 60 "thank you" events in the districts of Democratic members of Congress who voted "yes."
FDL called the house PO a win, even.
but by all means malign and marginalize progressive groups. Who needs them, right?
On the other hand, I called it watered down. It was.
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 3:57 PM in reply to Indie Pro
"but by all means malign and marginalize progressive groups"
Do people ever tell you that you tend to overstate things?
I am one anonymous voice, I do not have the power to malign and marginalize any group. And I still stand by my comment.
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 4:02 PM in reply to Viva!America!
I doubt you could truly marginalize, that's true. You can only do it in comment and opinion. But you are maligning.
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:12 PM in reply to Indie Pro
Oh IndiePro, you make me laugh sometimes. What in my statement was evil or untrue?
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 4:21 PM in reply to Viva!America!
maybe we are working off of different def's of malign:
to utter injuriously misleading or false reports about
you weren't implying that MoveOn was somehow switching their opinion on the House PO in an effort to make them look bad?
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FreeRider
December 18, 2009 4:26 PM in reply to Indie Pro
Says the maligner-in-chief of the president.
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 4:31 PM in reply to FreeRider
I'm not maligning the President. I've often called for him to actively champion the ideas from his campaign, like no mandate, and the PO that was in his campaign literature (see i did that for you).
I wonder about things like:
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/12/did_obama_pressure_fda_to_kill_drug_import_amendment.php
I don't like his more DLC moves, like hiring Rahm in the first place.
I do agree with his Green initiatives, and view on the 21 century economy. I would've prefered Biden's ideas for Afghanistan. Oh, we could go on and on. I voted for him, even after the FISA vote. I'm just not a democratic party right or wrong person. That's more the GOp style. Not mine.
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 4:55 PM in reply to Indie Pro
CREDO has joined;
The Senate is poised to pass a deeply flawed health care bill that doesn't include a public option but would require everyone to buy insurance, even if it's unaffordable or doesn't meet their needs.
Progressives are simply supposed to accept this giveaway to the insurance lobby because we're told that we need to pass something by Christmas and that nothing better can pass the Senate. On both counts, this is simply untrue.
Sen. Joe Lieberman has shown us that it just takes one senator to block a bill. We need one progressive senator to stand up and block a health care bill without a public option.
Ask Sen. Bernie Sanders to be a progressive hero and stand up for the public option. Click here to automatically add your name to our petition.
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:36 PM in reply to Indie Pro
There was no double meaning to my post. In fact its something that can be applied to life. After turning down or showing dissatisfaction with other options, you start to look at those options more positively when you realize that you might not get anything. There is no evil intent or anything untrue about that statement.
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 4:43 PM in reply to Viva!America!
so you were making a general statement, and not about MoveOn. Gotcha. Hindsight is 20/20, or so the cliched statement goes.
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:58 PM in reply to Indie Pro
Sigh! My comment was prompted by and includes MoveOn.
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vamonticello
December 18, 2009 3:24 PM
Moveon is a DISGRACE!!!!! They have finally LOST all their credibility, just like Howard Dean. They both went CARZY in the middle of a battle, they turned on their own, which is unforgivable.
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again
December 18, 2009 3:47 PM in reply to vamonticello
If they've finally lost all credibility, how did they manage to raise so much money over the last week?
You can't have it both ways.
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Indie Pro
December 18, 2009 3:50 PM in reply to again
over a million against Lieberman, or some figure like that, right?
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Walter Mitty
December 18, 2009 3:25 PM
Sanders is a lock to vote for the bill. Burris should be their target - he could easily be bought, especially since he's not running for re-election and is shady already.
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converse
December 18, 2009 4:14 PM in reply to Walter Mitty
Burris is my senator, and I just emailed him urging him to vote in favor of the bill.
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CT Voter
December 18, 2009 3:30 PM
MoveOn has now provided cover to conservative Dems to vote for cloture. They can piously insist that they're resisting the crazies of TEH LEFT.
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cmpnwtr
December 18, 2009 3:35 PM
Move On just lost my donations and membership.
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converse
December 18, 2009 4:12 PM in reply to cmpnwtr
They lost mine a while back when they first began to turn and run.
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mcc
December 18, 2009 3:38 PM
I'm on the MoveOn list but for some reason didn't get this email.
The MoveOn team says there is still a chance to "win" the health care fight and said the House bill is strong and has "a real public option."
I wonder what "real" means. The House bill doesn't have a public option that serves as a cost control. Do they claim in the email it does?
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converse
December 18, 2009 4:13 PM in reply to mcc
I wonder what "win" means. If they think they can get more through reconciliation, they're fooling no one.
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cmpnwtr
December 18, 2009 3:42 PM
Actually Move On's position may actually help the Senate Health Care bill. Since the Gen. Petraeus episode Move ON has lost a lot of credibility with the Congress and is seen as more of a liability than a help to Democrats.
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again
December 18, 2009 3:49 PM in reply to cmpnwtr
I'm getting a lot of feedback from people who've left OFA and moved to MoveOn.org
I'm not ready to join MoveOn.org, but they've been quite shrewd in positioning themselves to capture the people who have been leaving OFA since last spring.
Actually, I should write OFA/DNC. They're the same thing now.
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Lynn Dee
December 18, 2009 3:51 PM
"Move On just lost my donations and membership."
Me too. Very disappointing. One wants to think they mean well, but it's possible they are now just another business trying to make money.
It's tough out there, I guess, for an online grass roots organization.
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Skybolt
December 18, 2009 4:00 PM in reply to Lynn Dee
So when they were gathering donations by taking positions you happened to agree with, they were trustworthy, but now that you happen to disagree with them, they're suspicious? Believe it or not, it is possible for liberals and leftists to have disagreements without one side being dishonest or corrupt.
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again
December 18, 2009 4:14 PM in reply to Skybolt
What do you mean liberals v. leftists? I'm a Democrat and I'm considering throwing in with MoveOn.org, which I've actively disliked since "betray-us".
What is my option? HCAN? OFA?
How about "none of the above."
Which is how I'm feeling about 2010 and 2012.
Obama, please get a handle on your administration, and Dems in the Senate, too.
You're wasting an historic opportunity, and all the momentum for change we had in January.
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:19 PM in reply to again
What is your option? Neither. Why choose?
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:17 PM in reply to Skybolt
Wait, what's the difference between a Liberal and a Leftist? This is a serious question, because I thought the names were just interchangeable.
I agree with your second statement, but maybe people are turned off by their tactics. I don't know, just a guess.
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DB55
December 18, 2009 3:54 PM
30 million more covered, no discrimination on pre-existing conditions, real lives saved - and MoveOn wants me to help defeat this because they're stupid enough to think something better can pass the Senate? That's it - I'm resigning my membership and support for this group.
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Smartpill
December 18, 2009 4:15 PM
I think some of you should realize that Dean, Kos, Arianna, AND MovOn are doing the dirty job of sticking their fingers in the dike...
SOMEONE HAS TO DO IT!!
Or the right will keep on taking... Obama won't stop them...
And your going to stop supporting them.. sigh!
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Viva!America!
December 18, 2009 4:20 PM in reply to Smartpill
They are in the wrong dike, 'cause they haven't stopped anything.
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The Commenter Formerly Known as NCSteve
December 18, 2009 5:28 PM in reply to Smartpill
I'm still not convinced that Dean isn't in working in cahoots with the White House to keep Lieberman from finding another reason to be against it. Even if it ain't so, that's how it's working, so whatever.
On the other hand . . .
Arianna? Just being an idiot attention-whore, just like she was when she was tearing apart Bill Clinton, Gore and Kerry.
Move On? They're like the United Way now--as much as the organizational imperative to gather money and continue to exist as about the obstensible cause or causes.
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Powkat
December 18, 2009 6:15 PM
I signed it - my son has no insurance, and I would love for him to have some - but not this piece of garbage. I also wrote a scathing email to Organizing for American asking them to take my name off their lists because I wasn't going to be suckered again. Maybe if enough folks make noise we can be hear. Maybe.
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matt in so dak
December 18, 2009 6:27 PM
You cannot simply mandate away the problem of the uninsured. I and my wife and child do not have health insurance because we cannot AFFORD it, not because we don't WANT it. Just because some bill mandates that I have to buy it, does not suddenly give me the income to afford it. What is so confusing about this?
We make about $40,000 per year. Which is just over 200% of the federal poverty guidelines for a family of 3. We are not eligible for SCHIP, Medicaid or any other form of public assistance in our state. We have applied for everything available from the federal government and state DSS.
This is further compounded by the fact that we have to care for an elderly relative. They are 61 and receive about $1100 per month in Social Security. Because of that $1100 per month, they too are ineligible for any state or federal assistance beyond housing. But they already get free housing living with us and the government will not reimburse me for any of it. And, because they make $1100 per month, I can't legally claim them as a dependent, because while I provide a significant amount of support, I do not meet the legal threshold to claim them as a dependent.
I have been quoted many prices for health insurance. The lowest of these is $600 per month. I do not have $600 extra per month burning a hole in my pocket. That's 13% of my annual pre-tax income. Don't have it. Even if I was subsidized at say 50%, I still don't have $300 extra per month. And this doesn't even begin to take into account my elderly relative. In their case, our honest goal is just for them stay alive and reasonably healthy for 4 years until Medicare can foot the bill for their medical issues.
So what happens when I am told... buy health care or face a fine? I pay the fine and continue to get my health care through Community Health and the ER. Just because someone orders me to get health insurance doesn't solve the problem. I know many families who are in my exact same circumstances, and we all oppose any mandate without cost controls and a real public option.
Anyone Who Won't Lie in 2012
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bluebell
December 18, 2009 6:37 PM in reply to matt in so dak
The elites still control the Democratic Party only they are no longer liberal. This bill isn't about YOU or your healthcare. It's about THEM. They are reforming health just like they reformed poverty. Of course, no one is poor anymore because the poor were reformed and don't you dare complain about being sick after this bill is passed because they cured the sick.
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ilovebacon
December 18, 2009 9:52 PM
F*&% MoveOn.
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inokeah
December 18, 2009 11:47 PM
What is all this DRAMA about? It must be a liberal thing.
Harry has the votes, no matter what is in the bill. It can make Lady GaGa as the Health Care Queen and my Senators (Akaka and Inoye) would vote it in.
What is the big deal Harry, just get a pair and make it law. If you dont have'em call Nancy Peloci and borrow hers.
What is the worst that could happen, it distroyes the best health care in the world and you are run out of town with tar and feathers?
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