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MA Senate Debate Underscores Vulnerability Of Health Care Reform

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MA Senate candidates Martha Coakley (D) and Scott Brown (R).

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The candidates in the Massachusetts Senate special election debated this morning on a local radio station, with Democrat Martha Coakley and Republican Scott Brown setting up some stark partisan contrasts. But perhaps the most important message of the debate was Brown's promise to stop the health care bill in its tracks if he is able to pull off an upset two weeks from today and become the 41st GOPer in the Senate.

It was striking that Brown didn't try to soft-peddle the Republican message in this Democratic state. A big part of his campaign is that if he is elected, he would have the power to stop Democratic bills. Of the current health care bill he declared: "I would be the 41st senator and would stop that particular bill, because as a Massachusetts Senator I need to look out for our jobs and our hospitals." He later added: "I can stop it so they can go back to the drawing board and do something better for Massachusetts."

Coakley, the front runner, stressed the importance of passing some kind of bill in the Senate: "The people who don't want this desperately don't want health care reform. They don't want any kind of health care reform, and they use this [abortion] as a trigger."

During the Democratic primary, Coakley was heavily critical of the House health care bill and the Stupak Amendment. In the debate this morning, she indicated an openness to the Senate's version of abortion language, compared to the Stupak measure because it prevented people receiving federal subsidies from purchasing coverage for abortion with their own money. "The Senate version, though I don't love it, doesn't have that provision in it," Coakley said, also adding: "I don't love that amendment, but I do believe the Senate bill brings us closer towards the two goals of health care, promoting competition and bringing costs down."

Brown also took a hard line against the coming terrorism trials in New York City, lambasting Attorney General Eric Holder by saying, "It's time we stopped acting like lawyers and started acting like patriots." He also defended the use of waterboarding, disagreeing with Sen. John McCain (who endorsed him recently): "I do not believe it is torture. America does not torture, and we used aggressive, enhanced interrogation techniques."

Brown defended his use of a 1962 video of President John F. Kennedy in a new campaign ad, promoting a platform of tax cuts. "Let's talk about the ad real quick," said Brown. "Different people, different party, different era, same message -- lower taxes create jobs." He later added, "JFK was right, I agree with him, so I'm similar with him in that regard. Martha and the Democrat Party are not in line with JFK in that regard anymore."

Coakley responded that when Kennedy was proposing tax cuts in 1962, the top marginal rate was 91% -- a completely different circumstance from now. She also later said of the ad, "I think he's got the wrong president in the ad. I think it should be Scott Brown and George Bush."

There was also that third candidate at the debate. Software developer Joe Kennedy (who is not related to the famous Kennedy family, but simply shares their common Irish name) could potentially siphon votes from Brown with his staunch libertarianism, an important point if the race gets close. Brown is for blocking the health care bill; Kennedy is for repealing every single line of it after it passes. Brown is for cutting taxes and shrinking government; Kennedy is for eliminating the Department of Education. Even on tax cuts, Brown claims the legacies of Ronald Reagan and John F. Kennedy; Joe Kennedy hearkens back all the way to Warren Harding.

Interestingly, it was noted that Coakley was in favor of Kennedy's inclusion in the debate.

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January 5, 2010 12:12 PM   

Brown runs on "stopping the Democratic agenda" in a heavily Democratic state; He runs on stopping the expansion of health insurance coverage in the only state with universal coverage.

Yeah, this guy is a real threat to Martha Coakley. He'll make it as far as his daughter made it on American Idol.

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January 5, 2010 12:17 PM   

This race shouldn't be close. The fact coakley is only leading by 9 points is cause for concern.

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January 5, 2010 12:20 PM    in reply to Walter Mitty

CONCERN!

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January 5, 2010 12:31 PM    in reply to Walter Mitty

If Rasmussen says her lead is 9 points, I'd say it's at least 12.

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January 5, 2010 1:01 PM    in reply to Walter Mitty

You consider burnt toast a cause for concern.

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January 5, 2010 1:51 PM    in reply to FreeRider

Only if there isn't anybody making toast at the time and I can still smell it...

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January 6, 2010 9:40 AM    in reply to Walter Mitty

Noo cause for concern.......many don't participate in polls.....forgot

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January 5, 2010 12:30 PM   

Walter Mitty's "Fact" is a typical Rasmussen help-the-GOP poll. I'm conncerend, all right. Concerned that Ratsmissin gives trolls like Mitty here garbage to throw out there.

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January 5, 2010 12:35 PM    in reply to wellstone

Hey, he's not a troll, he's just dour.

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January 5, 2010 1:57 PM    in reply to The Commenter Formerly Known as NCSteve

Troll or dour, at least he's not as complacent as the Democratic leadership in MA. I live in MA and the only people excited about this race are Republicans/conservatives. These people have all the lawn signs, are standing on corners with placards, are lighting up the Globe blogs, are calling WTKK (well, sane people usually don't call or listen to TKK, so that's not a big deal) and are probably going to the polls. Democrats? Not a whisper. If this is close or if Coakley loses, Democrats (as usual) have no one to blame but themselves.

Norquist, who was hopeful that Brown would at least make a “stronger showing than expected,” argued that conservatives had a reason to help out Brown. “This is one of those lopsided things where if they win it’s nothing, and if we win it’s the cover of Time magazine.”

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January 5, 2010 2:18 PM    in reply to Schmed

I'm also from Massachusetts and would like to remind people that on Dec. 8th, 680,000 of those 'unenthused' people (Dems & Ind) in MA voted for a Democratic Senator and only 160,000 'highly motivated' (Rep & Ind) people voted for a Republican Senator.

If you think that in just 5 weeks Scott Brown has made up a 500,000 vote deficit, you've been listening to way too much rightwing radio and should really try getting out more. (And this isn't even taking into account the Libertarian candidate who wasn't in the primary but who will siphon off 5-10% of the Conservative vote in the final).

So yes, make sure Democrats get out a week from Tuesday because the GOP is going to spin anything less than a blowout as a GOP indicator but I wouldn't worry that Brown is actully going to win.

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January 5, 2010 2:52 PM    in reply to The Other Ed

If you think that in just 5 weeks Scott Brown has made up a 500,000 vote deficit, you've been listening to way too much rightwing radio and should really try getting out more.

I neither think that Brown has closed the gap the way Rasmussen is skewing it, nor do I listen to TKK (Jimmy Severino makes my ears bleed). Nonetheless, I worry that the complacency and apathy that make up the legs of the Mass Democratic party will only grow and have nasty consequences in November. It would be good if Coakley wins. It would be better if she wins in a landslide based on epic voter turnout in a non-Presidential election year. I long for the latter, but I'll take the former.

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January 5, 2010 2:37 PM    in reply to Schmed

Schmed-ley. A-men. Please keep trying to ignite some Dem fires. I'm shocked by the Democratic complacency in MA. And I'm surprised by the number of women who didn't feel it was worth a trip to the polls in Dec. to vote for Martha. One would hope they will this time, just to send a message to candidates like Brown who say one thing but let Pro-Life groups claim him as their own.

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LEP

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January 5, 2010 12:32 PM   

If Brown won or some other Democtatic senator died, couldn't the house just pass the exact bill passed by the Senate to eliminate another Senate vote?

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LEP

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January 5, 2010 1:07 PM    in reply to LEP

David Waldman at Daily Kos answers in the affirmative if the bill hasn't been amended by then.


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January 5, 2010 4:46 PM    in reply to LEP

Regarding HCR, the smart thing for the Dems to do now is nothing beyond talk. If Brown were to win the House would pass the existing Senate bill and changes/additions could be tried later.

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January 6, 2010 12:53 PM    in reply to LEP

Nope. The Stupak Group would kill it in the House. It does not have strong enough Anti-Abortion language. Remember, he had a block of 40 votes. The House passed *their* bill by only 5 votes! If even 6 of the 40 thought it was not stong enough, that bill is dead, even if the Liberal Support (and they lose a *lot* in that Senate Bill that *cannot* be changed by future laws -- or are you fogetting that niggly little and possibly Unconstitutional clause in *both* bills?) is 100% behind that move.

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dtr

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January 5, 2010 12:41 PM   

I'd be interested to know the polling on the current Health Reform among Mass. residents since HCR is so similar to RomneyCare, and what effect it could have on the voting outcome based on each candidate's HCR platform.

Read somewhere else the last Republican to win won based on fiscal conservatism and a liberal social platform. That seems to be the only possible model by which GOP could gain a seat, which ain't gonna happen in MASS.

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January 5, 2010 12:42 PM   

First off where do these republican assholes get off with their 'DEMOCRAT' party insults? I thought that name calling was popular in Texas not the rest of the civilized America. Every time I hear that insult I want to call the republicans the REPUBLIC party or the 'aristocrat party' or the 'rich greedy party' or something that is actually closer to the truth of the matter.

WHY LET THEM INSULT YOU? Next time just stop the whole proceeding and say excuse me but it is called the DEMOCRATIC party and could you keep your frat boy insults to yourself.

And to the point of tax cuts for the rich again, why oh why not point out to the 99% of people not getting their millions and billions in tax cuts that whatever the republicans manage to steal from the tax rolls for their rich friends gets put onto poor peoples taxes to make up the difference. Get out your check books you poor working slobs .... some rich guy needs a new boat to play with.

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January 5, 2010 12:47 PM   

It's great for us to discuss this on here, but I really beg you all to bring this conversation to Twitter under the #MAsen hashtag. The tea baggers have an organized "Revolution" going on (http://www.ladylibertas93.com has a good summary of their plans to stop health care). They have hijacked the entire #MAsen discussion despite the fact that 80% of the Brown supporters on Twitter do not live in Mass. They are using this to fundraise and recruit. They are using very systematic tactics (which are impressive) and a few not so appropriate tactics.

Regardless of how we discount Rasmussen Polls or online polls (which tea baggers are now flooding with out of state voters), do we really want to sit idly by and let our supporters think they can skip voting like they did in December, or allow the tea baggers to convince independents that hey, maybe the rest of Mass really believes in Scott Brown's politics.

A simple request, please follow http://twitter.com/marthacoakley and use the hashtag #MAsen to even the playing field online. And spread the word to anyone nationally who wants health care reform.

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January 5, 2010 1:04 PM    in reply to krisd

I beg you to quit paying attention to Twitter and reconnect to the real world. I suppose you also think, based on the Boston Globe article comments, that Mass. is full of teabaggers?

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January 5, 2010 1:19 PM    in reply to midnight rambler

Twitter and Facebook are not "blog comments" They are more like communication tools akin to the telephone. To ignore their usefulness as a way to communicate during an election is not a great strategy. We wouldn't ask Martha Coakley to ignore her phonebank strategy, would we? While it may not be the deciding factor in this particular race, it was a very useful platform for fundraising and recruiting for President Obama. This is why we should not discount it in this race or any of the much more closely contested races in 2010.

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January 5, 2010 1:07 PM    in reply to krisd

If we don't even the playing field online, Ron Paul may very well win both the Republican and Democratic primary!

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January 5, 2010 1:08 PM   

I'd like to see how he will STOP the bill. Where does he think he has that sort of power. Another disillusioned rethug...

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January 5, 2010 2:08 PM   

Rasmussen is owned by Opinion Research which is owned by FOX/ News Corp. If i were a Democrat or Republican i would not put much stock into this poll. Coakley is going to win. period.

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January 5, 2010 4:26 PM    in reply to ru4862

Thank you.

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January 5, 2010 4:41 PM   

So, health care reform is vulnerable because of the highly unlikely possibility that a popular Democrat, running to replace Ted Kennedy(!) in very liberal Massachusetts, might lose to a Republican.

As is often the case at TPM, decent post, but terrible headline (did you hire your headline writers from Politico?).

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January 5, 2010 4:51 PM    in reply to commie atheist

CA: a problem with the new media is that revenue is driven by page views, therefore the headlines need to be outrageous to attract the casual reader. TPM suffers due to this paradigm as do others. Some go a step further and create false dichotomies, which Politico is regularly guilty of.

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January 6, 2010 9:36 AM   

Scotty boy doesn't have a chance in hell to pass the finish line......sorry try again...this one is not a winner

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January 6, 2010 12:10 PM    in reply to monet768

He needs to be excoriated for trying to mislead voters.
It is dishonest, disingenuous, and just not relevant to today.

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