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Democrats: We're Excited To Debate GOP Shadow Budget...Why Aren't Republicans?

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House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-MD)

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Democrats aren't letting Republicans run away from the GOP shadow budget--a Social Security and Medicare slashing bill sponsored by their top budget guy, Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI). But they don't want the issue to disappear from view--in fact, they want it to be a defining issue of the 2010 election. And as such are trying to frame it just right--elevating Ryan and his proposal to magnify the differences between Democrats and Republicans.

"Representative Ryan has made a proposal, significant parts of which I do not agree [with]," said House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (D-MD) at his weekly press event this afternoon. "However, having said that, it is a serious proposal made by a member in my opinion who has very sincere objectives in mind. And it is a substantive proposal."

I asked Hoyer what he made of the GOP leadership's response to the Ryan plan.

"Mr. Boehner as I understand it, when asked which proposals in the Ryan proposal he [opposed] he couldn't articulate any of them," Hoyer said. "Mr. Ryan is the ranking Republican on the budget committee. If they were the majority, presumably he'd be the chairman of the budget committee. Some of the things he's proposed are controversial."

This is just one of the ways one of the ways Democrats are trying to force Republicans to confront the proposal, which could have long political legs.

"We definitely view this as a real gift as far as allowing us to finally have a real debate with Republicans on the issues," a Democratic leadership aide told me today. "I think the president when he did his Q and A with the Republicans, exposed them and their ideas and it's been something that--it has been difficult for us to do over the last year because we've been so busy passing legislation, we haven't been able to engage Republicans on their ideas and where they'd take the country."

"I think you're going to see an aggressive effort from outside groups and others who for a while, we've been all working to defend what we're doing, and that's allowed Republicans to basically run around basically untouched," the aide went on. "For them they have been able to avoid any scrutiny of what they'd do if they were in the majority"

"They're already running around measuring drapes for their new congressional offices," the aide said. "But before that happens we're going to force them to answer whether or not these are ideas that they support, and if they don't support them, what do they plan to do with Social Security, with Medicare, with the deficit."

Why are Democrats confident that this will stick? Why won't Republicans just walk away from Ryan unscathed? Because the conservative base is in charge of things now.

"Many of them are in primaries...this is the sort of thing that will drive a wedge between them and their conservative base," the leadership aide said. "They're going to have to keep an eye on the general...but they've got to get to the general."

And for that reason, you'll see a relentless push on the part of leadership to keep the shadow budget, and the Republicans who can't quite support or oppose it, on the surface.

"I admire [Ryan] for putting a very substantive [proposal] on the table," Hoyer said today. "I think the Republicans, if they don't support his proposal, put something else on the table."

Comments (30) | Join the Conversation!

Recommend Recommend (1)

February 9, 2010 2:35 PM   

So let's see... SS is now paying out more than it's taking in, The Senate HCR bill guts Medicare, and Ryan thinks benefits should go to people over 55 years old.
I'm liking the Republican chances here. Heh.

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February 9, 2010 2:59 PM    in reply to shooter242

Shooter2, are you insane? The Senate bill guts Medicare? What sort of PCP atmosphere are you living in?

The Senate bill makes efficiency a primary goal of the health care system, encouraging doctors to become part of practices that encourage cooperation; it looks for best-practices in treatment and prescriptions, trying to make the MOST out of limited resources and thus reducing costs.

The 'republican plan' simply pulls the money out of the system, essentially eliminating Medicare, and gives a small portion of that money in vouchers to seniors, telling them that they can figure out what works for themselves.

One plan tries to fix problems with Medicare, the other tries to eliminate the system. I'm also liking rebumblican chances, but I think maybe for different reasons than are you.

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February 9, 2010 3:15 PM    in reply to Shantyhag

"Shooter2, are you insane?"

Short answer: yes.

Never argue with an idiot.

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February 9, 2010 4:11 PM    in reply to Shantyhag

FYI - shooter is an old-timey (folksy maybe even) troll.

Actually, I think s/he makes some intellegent coments from time-to-time.

Just so you understand where shooter's coming from - s/he likes to stir the pot.

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February 9, 2010 6:38 PM    in reply to mcrose68

I think it's the picture of the dog that's got you fooled. How do you know how old shooter is????

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February 9, 2010 4:31 PM    in reply to Shantyhag

Shooterboy is just a stupid liar.

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February 9, 2010 3:06 PM    in reply to shooter242

Huh?

So lets see, repukes do prescription drug plan, unfunded, and for handouts to pharma. No prob. Just explodes medicare costs without dealing with the costs.

Hmmm, Repukes are against getting rid of the cap on SS deductions? That would help dealing with the problem and make all people pay into the system. Gee that makes sense.

Oh, lets do those private accounts to line the pockets of repuke campaign contributors and wipe out retirement savings. Look at what happened to 401k's. Oh, by the way, what has happened to pension plans over the last 30 years? They don't exist.

Repukes are just liars and the repuke media promotes the lies. Until the problem of lying propoganda by repukes is dealt with in the media things will not change.

Anybody with half a brain wouldn't give repukes a snowballs chance in hell. Problem is people are uneducated and blind, like you are and buy the bullsh*t. The b-movie actors war on education is paying dividends. You people are delusional.

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February 9, 2010 4:15 PM    in reply to Michael A

Yes, Repubicans like to spend money on everything from wars to pharma, and they like even more that once they've run up the tab the other party gets the blame when the American people have to pay for the Republican spending binges.

That sums it up pretty nicely, I think.

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February 9, 2010 3:06 PM    in reply to shooter242

For the record, the tipping point (more going out then coming in) will occur in 2016. Hasn't happened yet.

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February 9, 2010 3:23 PM    in reply to ohyeathatsright

If he read the annual statement Social Security just sent out, he'd know that.

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February 9, 2010 4:47 PM    in reply to Steaming Pile

Yes, I got mine this morning. ;)

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February 9, 2010 3:43 PM    in reply to shooter242

As I understand it, the Senate HCR bill does not 'gut Medicare': it gets rid of the $117 billion subsidy to pharmaceutical corporations (the savings in the bill) and it permits some kind of review board regarding costs and reimbursements.

But go ahead and use the Republican talking points which, as Frank Luntz has shared them with us, is to accuse the Democrats of advocating the very unpopular policies that the Republicans actually hold, but mask with these false accusations.

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February 9, 2010 4:19 PM    in reply to MyMy

By "gut's medicate" s/he means "guts the profits being made by the insurance companies who wrote Medicare Part D"

But my Republican friend explained it to me. . . If you disagree with massive governemnt spending on profits to politically connected, but completely unproductive industries, that means you support the terrorist.

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February 9, 2010 4:40 PM    in reply to shooter242

Hey shooter check out this fact

Social Security taxes and interest received over benefits paid out stood at $2.2 trillion.

That is a positive of $2.2 TRILLION AFTER EVERYONE WAS PAID FOR THE YEAR, WTF IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE?

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February 9, 2010 5:59 PM    in reply to rbeats

Too bad you didn't actually provide a cite, so I did.

So in 2008, we had net contributions of $672B and expenditures of $625B. No data for 2009 so far, but one can assume collections are down from 2008. You can make your own conclusions.

As for the fiction that there are trillions in assets, it is just that, fiction. Bonds are only promises to collect more taxes.

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February 9, 2010 11:29 PM    in reply to shooter242

"Bonds are only promises to collect more taxes."

ugh.

as if you'd ever imagine that that's a promise politicians couldn't keep.

but do keep it up with dispparaging the full faith and credit of these united states. that's the kind of patriotism we all expect from the republican party.

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February 9, 2010 5:31 PM    in reply to shooter242

problem with facts?

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February 10, 2010 10:58 AM    in reply to shooter242

At least there is an attempt to 'frame' the argument by Dems--This is much better than dismissing it out of hand..CALL ATTENTION TO THE PROPOSAL__HAVE THE CBO RATE IT __MAKE THE PRESS DO THE WORK OF COUNTERING THE ARGUMENTS>..EMBARRASS THEM IN PUBLIC __ON C-SPAN __ON the blogs --NPR. PBS--

Sunlight on the lies is the best way to squelch the them!

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February 9, 2010 3:51 PM   

The Democrats should point out that every seat in the House is up for election in the fall, which means that the American people could choose to give Republicans control of the House. If they do, then Paul Ryan gets to play a major role in writing the budget. That's why the American people need to understand Ryan's ideas, and decide whether they agree or disagree with them, before voting in November. If you vote for a Republican, you're choosing Ryan's budget. Certainly Obama can veto the worst parts, but the final budget would have to pass a Republican House.

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February 9, 2010 4:00 PM   

Yes let the Repudlickins seriously debate this. Go ahead Ryan get up there in front of the people and explain your plan. Let's vote on it dummy. Go ahead genius show us what you got. Drag all your pals down too, if they don't bail on your silly a** first. Har de har har.

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February 9, 2010 4:10 PM   

Ryan's plan will probably achieve its goals, a balanced budget, but it does show the amount of pain required to do so.

If nothing else, it is at least an *honest* approach to the problem and has the virtue of simplicity. Democrats would be wise to imitate that simplicity with something like "Medicare for all" instead of the 2700pg bill they currently have.

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February 9, 2010 4:28 PM    in reply to BillSoo

No, it won't achieve its goals. When's the last time a Republican president presided over a balanced budget?

If we learned anything from the 1990's it's that you balance the budget by promoting growth, not by cutting spending. And you promote growth by increasing the disposable income of the people who do most of the spending, i.e. the middle class.

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February 10, 2010 1:21 PM    in reply to mans_best_friend

My personal opinion is similar to yours....growth is better. All I'm saying is that Ryan's plan is at least an honest attempt to fix a problem (the deficit). In that sense, it is far better than the usual republican obstructionism.

Look at it this way, if Ryan is making a good faith attempt to put forward public policy based on FACTS, not FAITH, then he can be debated on the facts. Therefore, he theoretically can be turned "away from the dark side".

Also, his plan shows a lot of courage in that he cuts/privatizes Medicare and SS. Why can't we have a democratic plan that is just as brave? Putting the highest tax bracket up to 50% (same as during Reagan), and cutting military spending (including that in Democratic constituencies).

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February 9, 2010 4:30 PM   

This is perfect. The over 65 crowd has (according to FOX) been turning toward the Republican Conservatives. Now Ryan and his pals want to dick around with SS and Medicare. It will take exactly 24 hours after the first debate on this issue for the over 65 crowd to turn their backs on the Republican Conservatives. Go ahead, Ryan, try to change SS and Medicare and see how far you get. FAT CHANCE!

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February 9, 2010 4:38 PM    in reply to Agateman

Ryan's got help now, though! Steny Hoyer is gingerly carrying his nitro all the way to the ammo dump for him!

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February 9, 2010 5:29 PM    in reply to Agateman

With Faux news telling them to pay no attention to the man behind the curtain and the over 65 crowd not knowing that Medicaid is a government program (remember this past summer) and the Dems not saying anything, as they are prone to do until it’s too late, well it could get ugly.

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February 9, 2010 5:37 PM    in reply to BeeClone

Sorry, that should be Medicare not Medicaid.

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February 9, 2010 4:46 PM   

Maybe Ryan can work his magic and show how the Republicans would pay for Palin's war with Iran as long as he is saving so much money.

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February 9, 2010 5:27 PM   

This sort of gamesmanship has its place - and I realize that my next point applies primarily to the Senate - but it's really time for the Dems in Congress to actually get something done, not only from a political perspective, but so that our goverment can actually implement policies that will affect positive change for millions of Americans in the manner that voters voted for in massive numbers in the most recent elections. (sorry for the run-on!)

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February 9, 2010 5:59 PM   

The reply to asking to slash medicare and privatize social security: let's roll back the clock on taxes and restore the 90% tax rate.

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