
Republican leaders didn't waste any time before lambasting the White House's plan to salvage health care reform. House Minority Leader John Boehner ripped the White House for "[crippling] the credibility of this week's summit by proposing the same massive government takeover of health care based on a partisan bill the American people have already rejected."
Not so fast, says the administration. The White House has launched a website laying out a comprehensive list of Republican ideas in its health care proposal.
"Throughout the debate on health insurance reform, Republican concepts and proposals have been included in legislation," the site reads. "In fact, hundreds of Republican amendments were adopted during the committee mark-up process. As a result, both the Senate and the House passed key Republican proposals that are incorporated into the President's Proposal."
It's a familiar refrain. For months Democrats have been at pains to point out that they've been receptive to, and even adopted, a number of GOP-inspired ideas as they've designed their health care package.
Among those ideas is a GOP-themed measure to provide grants to states to experiment with malpractice reforms, and a provision that allows dependents to remain insured up to the age of 26.
Along the same lines, they're boxing Republicans in, encouraging them to come to the Thursday health care summit with their own plan, so that the White House can see a full list of their ideas.
House Republicans insist their ideas should be well known to Obama--"Our health care alternative - the full text of the legislation - has been available at healthcare.gop.gov for months, which the President knows, since he discussed it with us in Baltimore a few weeks ago," says Michael Steel, spokesman for House Minority Leader John Boehner.
The White House insists that its proposal exists as a "opening bid"--a place to begin negotiations with the GOP--but that if the GOP rejects their proposal out of hand, they can move forward without them. Looks like that's exactly how things are shaping up.
Politor
February 22, 2010 12:43 PM
This is the sort of thing that you hope the progressive wing of the party realizes is more about politics than anything else.
Unfortunately, I think it will be taken as an example of how the bill is "republican-lite."
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Indie Pro
February 22, 2010 12:54 PM in reply to Politor
only because I agree with Obama:
I know you guys disagree, but if you look at the facts of this bill [Healthcare Senate Bill], most independent observers would say this is actually what many Republicans — it is similar to what many republicans proposed to Bill Clinton when he was doing his debate on health care.
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Politor
February 22, 2010 1:03 PM in reply to Indie Pro
Wouldn't disagree there.
However, I also think if this effort fails the next attempt will be even less progressive than any bill currently in consideration. I mean, you need no more proof than the lunacy that was going on in the House after Brown won the election. The "split the bill in the popular components and pass them" lunacy. How was that more progressive than the senate bill?
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Indie Pro
February 22, 2010 1:07 PM in reply to Politor
I was merely replying to your comment:
I think it will be taken as an example of how the bill is "republican-lite."
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 1:14 PM in reply to Politor
Every time HCR goes down, the next bill becomes more conservative.
The nutbags on the left who think we'd get a more liberal bill if we killed this one have been sniffing glue.
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Michael A
February 22, 2010 1:19 PM in reply to FreeRider
Actually, again, that is a good point. Nixon's was more liberal than clinton's and clinton's was more liberal than this one. Good point.
I still don't like the mandate though.
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Indie Pro
February 22, 2010 1:22 PM in reply to Michael A
it's a false dichotomy, at best
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mans_best_friend
February 22, 2010 1:23 PM in reply to Michael A
The only way to make the whole thing work is to bring more healthy people into the pool. There's simply no way to get the costs down significantly without a mandate.
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 1:24 PM in reply to Michael A
How do you like health savings accounts and $1K tax credits for buying $10K insurance? That's what you'll get in 10 years if this bill goes down--if anybody is stupid enough to try this shit again.
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Indie Pro
February 22, 2010 1:20 PM in reply to FreeRider
cum hoc ergo propter hoc
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Schmed
February 22, 2010 1:42 PM in reply to Indie Pro
Correlation does not imply causation.
All the best fallacies have Latin names.
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lariokie
February 22, 2010 3:18 PM in reply to FreeRider
In response to FreeRider, we "nutbags of the left" happen to know that the issue can be resolved by simply passing a public option through the reconciliation process. You nutbags of the right don't want that to happen. You would rather see an immensely cumbersome and unwieldy HC program that doesn't work and won't cover those who need coverage the most. May I suggest that if you like the idea of a private insurance mandate, then go ahead and buy your insurance on the open market. But shut up when we nutbags on the left create a system that actually works.
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 3:33 PM in reply to lariokie
I'm on the left. I'm just not a nutbag.
FYI, the only thing you nutbags have created is confusion, panic and bullshit expectations about what was possible.
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Kevin Sutton
February 22, 2010 2:34 PM in reply to Politor
Isn't more accurate to say that everytime Democrats bring up HCR their leadership proposes centrist one, only to see it get defeated everytime when the GOP shifts rightward again?
...and consider this: HCR reform efforts went from partial success, (Medicare and Medicaid) to near success, (Close call with Nixon) to can't get out of committee, (Clinton) so the next attempt naturally won't get out of the sarting gate. It's silly logic.
That and it's not really true. You can't compare Clinton's initial proposals to the almost end-of-the-line compromise worked out between Nixon and Kennedy. Nixon's started out to the right of Clinton's and Obama's initial proposals and moved to the left to compromise with the opposition. There's no pattern to this, just different cases and actors.
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philogratis
February 22, 2010 1:19 PM
Nixon agreed on a bill more progressive than this and Ted Kennedy shot it down because he was going through his liberal lion phase. Later on he realized that was stupid.
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philogratis
February 22, 2010 1:20 PM
Nixon agreed on a bill more progressive than this and Ted Kennedy shot it down because he was going through his liberal lion phase. Later on he realized that was stupid.
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Steve LaBonne
February 22, 2010 1:37 PM in reply to philogratis
I'm sick of seeing this bullshit story repeated over and over. The truth is that there was indeed overreach on the Democratic side but it wasn't Kennedy who did the overreaching: "In a moment of bi-partisan cooperation, Nixon’s staunch foe, Ted Kennedy, agreed to a compromise deal and prepared to work to get the health care legislation passed through congress. However, the brewing Watergate scandal soon took over the headlines and distracted the President from pushing through with this initiative. With the President unable to continue to rally support, the efforts of the Unions, who hoped for a better deal under a new presidential administration, succeeded in derailing the Nixon-Kennedy health care bill."
Read more at Suite101: The Nixon-Kennedy Health Care Plan: How Richard Nixon and Edward Kennedy Worked For American Health Care http://modern-us-history.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_nixonkennedy_healthcare_plan#ixzz0gI6nfh0l
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 1:54 PM in reply to Steve LaBonne
In his memoir Ted Kennedy talks about his big mistake turning down a healthcare deal with Nixon.
His wife Vicky wrote this in an op-ed.
"In the early 1970s, Ted worked with the Nixon administration to find consensus on health-care reform. Those efforts broke down in part because the compromise wasn't ideologically pure enough for some constituency groups."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/18/AR2009121803506.html
But why would you believe the man who was actually there over something on the Internets?
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Steve LaBonne
February 22, 2010 1:59 PM in reply to FreeRider
Can you read at all? Which word in TED WORKED WITH THE NIXON ADMINISTRATION is beyond your feeble comprehension? Not a word that Vickie wrote is at any variance at all with the account I linked to.
What Kennedy regretted was the fate his compromise proposal met with due to forces beyond his control, not his (nonexistent) failure to compromise. Stop besmirching his memory for your pitiful trolling purposes.
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 2:04 PM in reply to Steve LaBonne
Grassley worked with Baucus, too. But walked away.
Ted worked with Nixon . . . then pulled the plug on healthcare with Nixon. You're you're claiming it fell apart because of Watergate.
Read Ted's autobiography, you moron. He is quite clear about what happened and it ain't this fairy tale you found on the Internets.
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Steve LaBonne
February 22, 2010 2:15 PM
Once again, that is simply false. He had in fact pretty much reached a deal with Nixon when, feeling increasing heat from Watergate and under business lobby and AMA pressure, NIXON backed out. That left Kennedy pretty much hung out to dry and unable to resist (misguided) pushback from labor against the Nixon / Kennedy compromise plan. But it is a disgusting libel on a great man to keep repeating the falsehood that Kenndy willfully pulled the plug on a plan that was otherwise set to pass. That's just not what happened (another factor that never gets mentioned in oversimplified caricatures of this period is that a compromise plan had actually passed the House Ways and Means committee only to be torpedoed by the scandalous downfall of Wilbur Mills), and once again I'm sick of hearing what essentially is an urban legend repeated as though it were true.
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 3:36 PM in reply to Steve LaBonne
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Read Kennedy's autobiography. I guess he libeled himself.
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Steve LaBonne
February 22, 2010 3:50 PM in reply to FreeRider
Which says pretty much what Vicky said, but again you don't know how to read. While I don't have the book handy and the relevant passage is not available online, this statement from the author of the standard biography of Kennedy gives the correct picture:
"But the notion that Kennedy “regretted” his failure to cut a deal with Nixon is largely bogus, according to Adam Clymer, a former Times reporter and the author of “Edward M. Kennedy: A Biography.” Rather, Clymer says, Kennedy’s regret was that the differences between both parties were unbridgeable, making agreement impossible and losing a historic opportunity — not that his side had failed to give up enough to get that agreement.
“Kennedy was sorry that they didn’t reach an agreement” and that both sides “never reached closure,” Clymer told our reporter, Amanda Erickson. He dismissed the idea that Kennedy regretted not giving up enough: “That’s not the same thing at all.” "
http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/bipartisanship/kennedy-historians-its-false-to-conclude-kennedy-would-have-ditched-public-option-for-compromise/
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FreeRider
February 22, 2010 4:00 PM in reply to Steve LaBonne
So you haven't read True Compass?
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Moose49
February 22, 2010 2:29 PM
To which my question is, why do this in exchange for zero votes? (Technically one, but it's gone now.) Why not tell the Republicans if no one votes for this, we're going to strip the bill of your ideas and pass the one that we think will be the best bill for the American people?
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mjshep
February 22, 2010 4:36 PM in reply to Moose49
"Why not tell the Republicans if no one votes for this, we're going to strip the bill of your ideas and pass the one that we think will be the best bill for the American people?"
I don't know, maybe because that would make too much sense, or because Obama really doesn't want a progressive bill.
Obama always seems to start out by negotiating with himself, putting forth something that's weak to begin with then compromising, and then compromising some more, until no one likes the result, at which point it fails.
Not a very good strategy.
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bdh
February 22, 2010 5:07 PM in reply to Moose49
I think we need to remember that a number of Senate Democrats need at least the semblance of bipartisanship, too. And they can't afford to be seen supporting a bill that their constituents view, fairly or unfairly, as too far left. It's not as simple as trading an amendment for a Republican vote. All this business--the compromise bill and the appearance of bipartisan effort it signifies--does more to keep the "big tent" Democratic caucus together than it does to seriously sway Republican votes. Votes are being won with this stuff. They just aren't Republican votes.
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Moose49
February 22, 2010 5:21 PM in reply to bdh
I understand what you're saying. But if the senators in this category number no more than nine, then we don't need their votes, either.
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bdh
February 23, 2010 2:13 AM in reply to Moose49
In a hypothetical situation, I would agree. But this "jobs bill" stuff is even trickier than most. Blue Dogs need a sort of double cover here. The senators in question don't want to vote for a bill perceived as too far to the left. But they also can't afford to be seen voting against a jobs bill. Blue Dogs have an especially difficult situation in that they have to please Democratic voters and non-Democratic voters who might be willing to vote for them in something closer to equal measure than a senator with a more substantial party base available to offset the losses resulting from a less robust appeal to the non-base. Sometimes this double cover even involves a prerequisite of some token Republican votes to discourage or take the bite out of whatever ads their eventual opponents might run. In extreme cases, they literally need every single vote they can possibly get. They don't have the luxury of strategically sacrificing a smaller number of votes for a larger number. So they have to walk that gossamer thread. Others only have to walk a tightrope, while still others have a beam. And then there are those lucky few who, for reasons of demographics or circumstances or both, more or less have a full-on suspension bridge in front of them. And the party wants all of these senators to get re-elected. One in the hand is almost always better when it comes to electoral calculations.
This all assumes these people are 100 percent political animals, less motivated by ideology than political survival. My observation has been that usually, for better or worse, that is pretty much the case, especially with Blue Dogs.
Anyway, I'm describing these concerns not because they're insightful but because I think they probably should apply when looking at this particular situation. These factors are why I think the leadership needs, especially on a difficult issue like this one, to give these problem senators the vote they need and not just the vote the leadership wants for the legislative situation at hand.
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MASON
February 23, 2010 7:00 AM
if the GOP rejects their proposal out of hand, they can move forward without them. Looks like that's exactly how things are shaping up.
I'm not so sure.
This whole thing is a game of brinksmanship. Of course, the White House and the Dems want the GOP to reject the proposal out of hand. That clears the path to pass the existing Senate bill in the House and the rest through reconciliation.
The next move for the GOP, if they are smart, would be to not reject it out of hand. Rather to appear conciliatory and to agree in principle to some sort of compromise but insist that the revision be passed again through the Senate as a new bill.
That would put the onus back on the Democrats. Do we accept their offer in good faith or do we reject it out of hand?
If you reject it, you set yourself up for legitimate attacks that the whole HCR Summit was nothing more than a show, and it is in fact the Democrats who are operating in bad faith.
If you accept the olive branch then you open the entire process again to endless delay. Which is of course exactly the outcome the Republicans want.
We'll see.
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NobleCommentDecider
February 23, 2010 10:32 AM
John McCain was going to give everybody free care in emergency rooms, but you turned him down, why?
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