Here’s a long, sad story about how Democrats’ basically true claim that House Republicans voted to end Medicare ended up “winning” PolitiFact’s Lie of the Year award — a development that will help the right and the GOP create their own reality as the future of the social safety net becomes a defining issue of the 2012 campaign.
Back in April, House Republicans passed a budget that included a plan to phase out Medicare over several years and build in its place a subsidized, private insurance marketplace for seniors.
Democrats called this a vote to “end Medicare.”
You can quibble. It wasn’t a vote to end Medicare — BLAM! — all at once. But under the GOP plan, within a couple decades, the current health retirement program for old people would be gone and in its place would be an entirely different one. It would just, by political design, have the same name: Medicare.
Ignoring policy in favor of process, and with an eye toward political balance, PolitiFact rated this basically true Democratic claim “Pants on Fire.”
Liberals, economists, health policy experts, and yours truly objected strongly to PolitiFact’s conclusion. But instead of rethinking their conclusion, the PolitiFact turned the opprobrium into a badge of honor: The claim itself became a candidate for PolitiFact’s “Lie of the Year” contest; Paul Ryan — the House GOP budget chairman who authored the plan — engaged in a modest ballot stuffing campaign; and the Democrats’ true “lie” came in third place, just behind the GOP claim that the stimulus created zero jobs, and Sen. Jon Kyl’s claim that abortion services are “well over 90 percent of what Planned Parenthood does.”
But you can’t be a fact checking organization and leave epistemic questions up to voters. So PolitiFact made a choice. And of those three frontrunners, they selected the only one with any truth behind it.
The reaction from Republicans has been muted so far — a sign, perhaps, that they don’t want to reopen this old wound. But back in their districts, when constituents grill them, Republicans will now have a compelling citation. It just happens to be a sham.
Brian Beutler
Brian Beutler is TPM's senior congressional reporter. Since 2009, he's led coverage of health care reform, Wall Street reform, taxes, the GOP budget, the government shutdown fight, and the debt limit fight. He can be reached at brian@talkingpointsmemo.com.
i seriously doubt that republicans will bring this up. oh, it isn't 100% true. just 98% true...
Who watches the watchmen?
Does TPM want to be a relevant source of journalism? Then dig into who owns and controls Politifacts. For example, who finances them? In whose interests do they work?
out of the loop I don't think that's the cause of this nonsense. It's just that "balance" tends to trump accurate reporting in those media outlets that aren't deliberately partisan. Since being "balanced" instead of pointing out that one side really is objectively worse than the other favors conservatives and Republicans, the Cult of Balance is just as bad Fox-style propaganda.
It would seem that the folks who operate 'Politifacts' did to 'Politifacts' what Ryan did to Medicare: replace substance with offal covered by dissembling ephemera and perfume (to hide its malodorous composition).
These punks need an attitude adjustment. Every one of these Republican party of no traitors to this great Republic need their ass's kicked hard. Count them down to their next political race and the chance to elect them out and then ban them from doing any bussiness with anyone in any political platform! Its time for some new laws! Put a layer between the lobbyists and the lawmakers where lobbiest can not contact congress and congress can only act on issues presented to them by a special panel that would weed out lobbyist's influence. Limit income during and for 5 years after serving office to get people who want to represent the people!
Media Matters is the only FACT CHECKERS that I trust to reveal the Truth. Politifact has now discredited itself and thus no longer believable.
Politifact has made mistakes in the past and this one is an oversight merely on the basis of the timeline and discounts that fact.
I think Politifact is due for a correction.
So would Politifact have our backs if instead of raising "taxes" on the 1%, we just raised some "fees" on them? We can still run ads saying we didn't raise taxes?
That's just semantics, like the word Medicare. Nobody gets upset that there won't be a program named Medicare around when they retire. They're upset that there won't be guaranteed health care for them when they retire. They don't give a damn what the name of the program is.
Medicare needs to be seriously reformed because as it stands now it's nothing more than corporatocracy. For example, rich people don't need medicare, period. Secondly, it should be optional. Third, mandatory minimum sentences for corruption.
JohnPidaras What makes it "corporatocracy"? Is it less or more corporate than having to go to a corporation to pay for insurance?
If you set the bar high enough for rich, yeah, they can pay for their own care. But how much money is enough to cover you and everyone you care about? I'm not sure I'd feel completely safe on that count if I had $10 million.
It's optional to use. I guess you mean optional to pay into. What happens to all the people that didn't pay? We leave them out on the curb to die?
Do you have evidence of a high level of corruption or is that a red herring?
JohnPidaras Medicare could be totally fixed by allowing anyone who want's to buy into it do so.
These are politicowards. Nobody should take them seriously.
It doesn't "end" Medicare? That's like someone breaking up with you but wants to stay good friends.
Ryan's Medicare Plan hands seniors a ticket on the Cat Food Express. And that's supposed to be the good part of it.
It's not exactly news that Polifact stretches to find some Democratic statement as false as what Republicans put out routinely. It's sad, but not news.
If Politifact had gonads, I would punch them.
"The public will believe anything, so long as it is not founded on truth."
Edith Sitwell (1887 - 1964)
http://quotationspage.com/quote/1337.html
Politifarse lost my interest long ago. I can't even remember which issue but they have been 180 degrees off reality before - that's when they lost me.
The truth cannot be established by any media outlet. Bias or not, ideologically left or right the truth will elude most all of them no matter how hard they might sincerely search for it.
Handy I like what you accidentally did there!
Politifact + farce -> Politifarce + arse -> PolitifArse
I don't necessarily disagree with this article. I think PF is violating its own standards with its analysis. But -- and I'm just throwing this out there -- is it possible that in the way their opposition was worded, Dems could be perceived as trying to create the impression that the GOP budget plan would have eliminated all health care support for seniors?
chrisg You think?
I propose replacing the US Army with a 7 toddlers. But it will still be called United States Army, therefore, I am not making any changes to it at all. chrisg
PolitiFact appears to have a different definition of "Medicare". But the best thing for them to do in that situation was to avoid the question, not to discredit their own work.
This is actually quite sickening.
So basically "Politifact & Paul Ryan" have been paid off to shove Gramma under the bus!!! While I'm not surprised, I just want to know when will the tea-potty sheeple wake up and stop voting against their own (& our) best interests!??!
Besides the basic facts shown by Benen/Krugman and others showing how ridiculous this pick was, this was actually voted 3rd (and there is evidence that Paul Ryan used his email lists to stuff the ballot box. Voter fraud anyone?) behind two actual lies.
The results were:
The economic stimulus created "zero jobs." -- The National Republican Senatorial Committee and other Republicans - 24%.
Abortion services are "well over 90 percent of what Planned Parenthood does."- Sen. Jon Kyl, R-Ariz. - 17%
"Republicans voted to end Medicare." -- The Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and other Democrats. - 16%.
PolitiFact ought to be ashamed of itself at this pandering to the "...on the other hand" journalistic canard. The Lie of the Year should actually be a lie, as opposed to the "semantic overreach" they plucked out of 3rd place.
The Other Ed Why do you want to pretend that retards "believe in facts"?!?!
They were inadvertantly, truthful in their assessment. Their choice of "lie of the year" was actually correct. Their choice WAS the lie of the year, for them.
Politifact is the unfortunate scat of K-street lobbyists gang-banging 3rd-way, blue cur willing bitches. I've never expected truth from shameless scavengers. The Other Ed
It also ends Pizza as we know it.
Politifarce. We put our finger on the scale to provide "balance" where there is none.
Looks like Politifact finally cashed in and got the Koch money it was seeking.
Ryan and his fellow health insurance lobby lackeys in the Republican Party took a "General MacArthur"approach to destroying our nation's Medicare system. His plan would not have made it immediately die -- he simply wanted it to slowly fade away.
… and with it the ability of future senior citizens to obtain affordable chronic condition treatment andpreventative health care.
Bottom line -- most Congressional Republicans do not have the best interests of the vast majority of Americans at heart ... and every day, more and more Americans are coming to this realization.
We took Rover out back and shot him in the head, but you can't claim we killed Rover because we went and bought a new dog from the pet store and named him Rover!
Or: we bought a godfish and named <i>him</i> Rover instead!
Politifact's lie of the year for 2011 turns out to be the lie of the year for 2011
PS who CARES whiat politifact says, it may even gin up the discussion more often so the progressives can call them liars. Every time a Republican claims this Politifact posture as their authority, their Dem opponent needs only read the bill out loud, or at least the more-pertinent parts.
Republicans shouldn't even be TALKING ABOUT it, let alone debating it at any length, their own votes can be counted on the record, along with segments of that sorry legislation that are hard to read any other way.
Dems just need to find the most egregious double-talk segments and memorize them.
The script is already writ large on the public record.
Brian, it is NOT just a quibble. That there would exist a program to help pay most of the medical care for older Americans under the Ryan plan means that not only would the name continue to exist, but so would the program - in both intent and in fact.
Both before and after, the program would continue to be one of the the largest pieces of the federal budget. Explain how that could be if it was being ended.
You may quibble over whether you think it is a good idea, whether you think seniors will get worse care, will have to spend more out of pocket, yada yada ad infinitum. But that's about it, and those who can't see it are either lying liars or don't understand the meaning of the words being used. I'll let everyone decide which category best fits here.
truth-spin Democrats need to change to the term "eviscerated" medicare or "gutted" social security, those spins have so much more of a visceral effect, without calling it an "end." It would be accurate, too.
truth-spin The issue remains just as bad for the Republicans, because they can't erase their votes to eviscerate medicare and gut Social Security.
Dem ads don;t even need to use the term "end medicare" , all they have to do is say "hand your medicare savings over to private insurors", or "turn your medicare coverage into another government voucher that only makes the insurance companies even richer, and does nothing to protect you from price gouging..."
This Politifact spin was not nearly the wonderful boon to republicans they think it will be, because it will force them to talk about the Ryan Bill, which can't be erased from the public record.
Politifact may be able to spin the word "end" all they want, but they can't remove the Ryan Bill from the public record.
JEP What you fail to understand is that doing nothing is what will eviscerate medicare. Inaction, cowardice and political malfeasance will gut Social Security. Bold actions are needed in order to say them.
Reverse Godwin: The Democrats are the Neville Chamberlains of our age. They head back to their districts with voting records in hand showing they support doing exactly the same thing leading to ruin.
Although the GOP still hasn't figured out how to explain their position in a way that makes the truth fully clear, they will at some point and we'll be better off for it.
JEP From Krugman today:
"Republicans voted to replace Medicare with a voucher system to buy private insurance — and not just that, a voucher system in which the value of the vouchers would systematically lag the cost of health care, so that there was no guarantee that seniors would even be able to afford private insurance.
The new scheme would still be called “Medicare”, but it would bear little resemblance to the current system, which guarantees essential care to all seniors."
So, how is that different that what the Democrats propose in reducing the rate of growth in reimbursements to doctors and hospitals to below the general health care inflation rate? Sure, you'll say that because the government is such a large buyer, the providers will just have to take the price-fixed deal. Well, then why isn't that true with the insurance companies? The government will still set the terms of participation and will have the weight of the full quantity of Medicare consumers as leverage to use in setting rates.
Look at it this way, in effect the Ryan plan turns Medicare into the FEHBP, which is the health plan that Members of Congress and all other federal employees have. Why is that so bad?
truth-spinJEP members of congress are part of the 10% of Americans that make over $100k / year. what they pay in premiums (if anything) is not what the average american can afford.
BeyondTheBlingJEP Members of Congress pay the same co pays as every other federal employee. They are affordable. Look up FEHBP and you can see the rates for yourself.
truth-spinJEP Because it's not Single Payer?
truth-spinJEP It hasn't worked that way thus far with private insurers, because none of them is big enough to have the buying power of the government -- and we don't want them to be that big. What happens now is that doctors simply refuse to accept payment from your crappy private insurer, while they can't, as a practical matter, opt out of accepting Medicare.
These privatization plans are just plans to enrich the already enriched private insurers -- they don't and won't save patients any money.
truth-spin That's just the point, IT WOULD NOT CONTINUE TO PAY THE MAJORITY OF A SENIORS MEDICAL BILLS. The plan as written increases with inflation. Meanwhile health care costs increase at a rate 3x that of inflation, so there will come a point when the majority of the bill is paid by the senior not some government subsidy. Even Ryan knows it's an idiotic plan that's why he's drafting a new proposal with a democratic rep from Oregon. This new plan will at least base the subsidy on the rate of health care costs. However, since most private insurance companies pocket almost 1/3 of the premium - I still don't see how privatizing medicare is a good idea.
BeyondTheBlingtruth-spin and the real issue with healthcare cost is institutional gouging on an historic scale.
It would represent one of the biggest thefts in history if were somehow quantified.
And the worst culprits are the pharmie goons, they have poisoned us with our own medicine. And literally overcharged us probably worse than any industry on Wall Street.
JEPBeyondTheBling There is some of that, JEP, but it isn't the problem. The problem is that everyone expects everything to be done when it comes to the care of themselves or their family / loved ones. Which we can all understand. Another problem is that we compensate providers based on what they do, so they often do as much as they can. And the last big problem is that lack of information that consumers get. Pricing, outcome and quality of life should all be part of every discussion. In a resource constrained world, which is reality, we need to make trade offs and set priorities.
truth-spinJEPBeyondTheBling
We already know how to solve the problem of medical cost inflation because we have areas in the country where much more effective care is delivered more cheaply, and it has nothing to do with commercial insurance. Places where physicians get paid more when they do more and where hospitals are for-profit cost more. Places where physicians are on salary and hospitals are non-profit cost less - and their health outcomes are better.
I don't think it gives Republicans fire because they still won't rely on the "liberal media" to support their claims, but it's infuriating none-the-less. As stated here, the only claim of the top three with a SHRED of truth to it is the one that's the lie of the year. For my money, and I did say this before reading it here, I thought the claim that the stimulus created zero jobs was the lie of the year. The Democratic "lie" is a matter of interpretation, and a pretty bad interpretation at that. One of their top complaints was that the ad showed people "clearly over 55" being punished. Well...who ever said it affected CURRENT seniors? Democrats never said that, yet that was Politifact's unfair interpretation.
Meanwhile, you have out-and-out full-blown lies like the one about Planned Parenthood and the one about the stimulus creating zero jobs, but those aren't the lie of the year. It's absurd.
- spam
- offensive
- disagree
- off topic
Like